United Kingdom 77-1
1. UK 77-1 Gururaj. It's a real joy to be here this afternoon. My heart floods with this joy and especially coming together with meditators who have been practising. Whatever wells up in your heart, inspires me to well up my heart. It is a communication that takes place, which knows no bounds. There are no limitations whatsoever. And in this communication, the oneness of all is so deeply felt. What greater inspiration could there be? What greater joy could there be in the sweet, soft, gentle atmosphere of oneness? Can we start with a prayer? From the point of light within the mind of God Let light stream forth into the minds of men Let light descend on earth. From the point of love within the heart of God Let love stream forth into the hearts of men, May Divinity return to earth. From the centre where the will of God is known, Let purpose guide the little wills of men The purpose which the Masters know and serve. From the centre which we call the race of men Let the plan of love and light work out And may it seal the door where evil dwells. Let light and love and power restore the plan on earth. Namasté. Gururaj. ............. (Gururaj chants in Sanskrit) Om. Om. Om. Shanti, Shanti, Shanti. Gururaj. Good. Fine. Who’ll start us off with a question today? Questioner. Gururaj, does evil exist ............... (Inaudible)
2. UK 77-1 Gururaj. The question is, does evil exist, where does evil exist, why does it exist? What is the purpose of evil? Who creates evil? Where does evil come from? All these questions are incorporated in the primal question. Now evil does exist but, is evil real? Is it within the boundaries of reality or is it in the framework of unreality? If evil exists, who created evil? Now, if we regard Divinity to be something good and pure, why should Divinity create evil? Good. Is it not better to say that what is evil is a creation of man and not a creation of God? The mind perceives evil and because of its perceptions of evil, that very perception is translated into action which is regarded to be evil. Yet in different times and climes, what is evil today might have not been evil then. So evil is governed primarily by man's conception of things. Evil is a force that could be regarded as something non-evolutionary and good is a force which is evolutionary. Anything that leads one closer to home is evolutionary. Anything that makes our path smoother is evolutionary, and that which gives us greater joy is evolutionary too. You would say that some people find pleasure in being evil but then that pleasure is an unbalanced pleasure coming from an unbalanced mind. But the same person would not find joy in wrong actions. His joy would be in right actions. Now it is a common experience of all of us that when we do someone a good turn, when we carry a smile on our face instead of a frown, it makes us feel good. And that is a good action which balances well with a balanced mind. Now, the perception of evil, or what we regard as evil, can only be created by the mind, or the mind interprets a given situation in a certain manner which is not conducive to the laws of society, contrary to that which would be, which would bring society to greater stability, that we call evil. In our Western countries, we might call polygamy to be evil, while there might be some other countries, where the very same situation would be regarded as normal and good. So, from this we can evil is a conception. If evil is a conception of the mind then good, too, is a conception of the mind. Because without good, evil cannot exist, without evil, good cannot exist. So there is the greatest problem, there is the greatest conflict that is within man. The greatest conflict because the mind conceives of two opposing forces and wherever there are two forces that oppose each other, naturally, contradictions arise and conflicts arise. And that is the cause, or it perpetuates an already imbalanced mind. Good. What is the solution? That is what we are interested in. How to go beyond this? That is what we are interested in, and the answer is contained in the question, that one has to go beyond. Good. Now, when the mind refuses to accept evil, it will also refuse to accept good. And when one reaches that stage of beyondness where everything can be looked at with an equal eye, then only can the mind gain total balance. And when the mind gains total balance, there is total tranquillity. Where there is total tranquillity, there is total peace. Where there is total peace there is total understanding. Where there is total understanding there is total love. And when we swim in this
3. UK 77-1 beautiful ocean of love and feel its waves bathing every pore in our bodies, then we see no goodness and no evilness. Then what to do we see? We see Divinity, who is beyond good and beyond evil. So what have we done now? We have gone beyond the law of opposites. And is it is only when man transcends and goes beyond the law of opposites, that we realise reality. In the relative sense in which we dwell, with mind and body being of relative matter, there is no difference between body and the mind, it is just a matter of gradation, matter of degree, or matter of subtlety. The body is gross and the mind is more subtle, yet both body and mind fall in the same framework of matter. Good. And that matter, even at its finest level, is still relative. So, to be able to find this peace and tranquillity, to be able to solve our problems, to be able to view conflict in its proper context, we have to be beyond it. And that is what we try and do through our meditation and spiritual practices, is to be able to stand aside and observe. Now there is a process here. The first process would be participation. Good. What do we, what participates? What do we participate in? What is participating? Good. The first step: the ego participates in perpetuating itself and in its self perpetuation; it aligns itself with externality, with external circumstances, with the environment. Fine. The ego at first participates with itself and its environment. Good. Now in that participation, it identifies itself with the environment and because of the identification of the ego and the environment, does the perception occur that this is good and this is bad. That is the stage where most people are. Then we come to the second stage and the second stage, is where we become observers. Now, we had the ego and environment, and now we reach the stage of the observer, where the observer observes the ego and the environment. Stage one: participation of the small self with the environment. Stage two: to stand aside with the real ‘I’ within one, and observe the ego acting or interacting with the environment. Fine. Participation, observation. Now, we come to the third stage and the third stage involves participation again. We progress from participation to observation and then back to participation, but the second participation is a different kind of participation where, having learnt to observe, having learnt to discriminate between the real me and the ego me, and the ego's relationship to the environment, the big I participates in a very beautiful manner. And the manner in which it participates is this, that it permeates the ego. And by permeating the ego, the ego loses its sense of importance, because it is now permeated by something greater, something bigger, something sublimer. Good . Now, when the ego participates itself with the big I then its relationship, the ego's relationship with the environment also assumes a different quality of participation and that quality of participation becomes an identification. So the ego, in
4. UK 77-1 its humility, the humility which the ego discovers in discovering the big I, now participates with the environment in a greater, humble manner. Good. And in that humility, lies the beauty of love. So this is so simple. We have participation, observation and participation again but on a higher level. And when we reach the second participation upon the spiral, then environment, small self, big self becomes one self, becomes one self. And that is how we recognise Divinity in everything around us. We recognise Divinity in the meanest worm and in the highest evolved man. Everything we see is Divine. Have you ever seen a flower smiling at you? It does, you know. It can even speak to you. Yes, yes. Have you ever heard the finest Symphony in the world in the whistle of the wind? It's a great symphony. No human mind can conceive of such a symphony. Because the wind that blows through those trees are not created by the trees. It is a natural, (Gururaj is offered a glass of water) - water, sure, thank you. Aide. While there's a pause, I could just relate some experiences that meditators have had in the United States. Gita and I have noticed that in the last six or eight months, people that ........ (Inaudible) they will start having experiences when they're walking down the street one day and there's a very sweet smell suddenly and it doesn't seem to be coming from anywhere, that is there's no incense around or anything like that Gururaj. Beautiful Aide. And sometimes also sound. That people will be meditating one time and they hear very, very lovely sounds, sounds that are very difficult to describe. It's easy to describe physical sounds, but it's very clear that they're actually hearing sounds. ................... (Inaudible) Gururaj. Lovely, so this is something very nice to hear. My British family is also progressing. So nice. So, so beautiful. Yes, I'll have that. (General laughter). Aide. It was for you. Gururaj. I know. And even water, given or with love, tastes like nectar. Thank you. So, here we are seeing, perhaps systematically, perhaps as far as the mind can go, how Divinity can be infused in every action, in every mode of life, with the environment, within ourselves and with Divinity itself. Then separation ceases. Then I am the environment and the environment is me. And within that, the beautiful thread of Divinity becomes part and parcel of the necklace. So here is a practical example of the trinity we find in everything. Here is the trinity we find in everything, and that is how life becomes
5. UK 77-1 more and more joyous. Then we stop observing evil, and being embodied, you cannot help observing it. But when you observe it, you will observe it from a different angle. You will observe it from a more non-attached angle. Every action that is performed, every action starts with thought. Right. When that thought through meditation becomes more finer, when that thought becomes more refined, then our actions too become more refined, because they are now in the flow of the current. They are flowing with nature and not against nature. Then we see things as they are in a far greater living spirit. And that is the spirit of Divinity. Yes, that is the spirit of Christ, that is the spirit of Krishna. That is the spirit of the Buddha, where Christ, Krishna, Buddha they all become alive. They are alive in the meanest worm and in the highest evolved man. So when it comes to a philosophical or metaphysical question, we always try and relate it to practical terms, where even the most evil person will not seem so evil to us any more, but we will find the goodness in that person. We will see goodness in everything and that is how we evolve, and that is an expression of evolution. And when it through all various evolutionary stages, we progress, then our progress is stimulated more and more and this love force, this light that we heard of in the prayer, shines through us more and more. And that is how life becomes more and more joyous. It is no good, or it would not make any sense, rather, to meditate half an hour in the morning and half an hour in the evening, when the twenty three in-between hours has not assumed a better quality. The waking hours must have a higher quality, and even the state of sleep must be a better quality sleep. And then by these means, when things become more conducive to us and we become more at-onement, when we find more at-onement with the environment then we know surely that we have progressed. It is not the flash experiences that many people gain during meditation that are important. No, they're not important at all because the very, the visions or the light flashes, they are still not of a very high category, they are still very elementary. One needs to have no experience in meditation at all, but the vibration that is set up within us. And through setting up that vibration, heightening that vibration, we attune ourselves to a higher vibration, we attune ourselves to that shakti. And when we attune ourselves to that shakti then we feel the presence in our waking state of life, in our daily living. So, back to the question, the answer is simply this, that in order to solve the problem of good and evil, there is no such thing of overcoming evil altogether. Christ tried, Buddha tried, Krishna tried, great reformers tried, I am trying. No , the solution would be to go beyond it, because good and evil are within the forces of nature. There are, wherever there is expansion, there is contraction, wherever there is cold, there is heat, wherever there is rain, there is sun. The law of opposites will always remain in relativity. The law of opposites will always remain within nature. But it is to go beyond
6. UK 77-1 nature and then come back to it, participate in it from a complete different angle wherein that Gurushakti or Divinity or whatever label you want to put on it, is actively participating. Okay. Fine. Thank you. Questioner. ........... (Inaudible) Gururaj. Oh I’m so sorry. Do you hear me well at the back? You don’t hear me well at the back? Is that better now? Good. Fine. Thank you, Sybil. Ah, such, such utter joy, such utter joy. Good. Aide. ... (Inaudible) .... those of you who would like to ask questions, can you get in line ... (inaudible) Questioner. Gururaj, my question is a bit of a personal nature but I think some people will benefit. I come from a Brahmin, Hindu family and I was given Vibrit Tree Samsar twenty years ago, and since then I have been practising along with meditation. I joined the Meditation Society only a few days ago and at that time, when I wanted to join, I had this in mind because I wanted to know more about Gayatri, Sandya, but I heard that your approach is a bit different. While I really wanted to know was more about my way of doing meditation, that is Sandya and Gayatri, is it possible for you to discuss it here? Gururaj. Yes, your way of doing your own practices and prayers could be good for you. There is nothing wrong in that. And of course your personal practices and prayers should be discussed personally with me because they are your personal practices. So, if you would like to come and see me, I would gladly, I would be very glad to discuss it with you, go into the deeper details of it with you. And of course, I will put it to you various alternatives which you yourself must choose, because I can't evolve you, you have to evolve yourself. I, as your guru am only a guide. Okay? As Norman so beautifully quoted in one of his Newsletters, that my mission as the external guru is to awaken the internal guru within you. So your personal practices must be discussed with me personally. Why? To have a personal answer. Just that simple. I want to tell you a little story to relieve the tension a little bit. It’s ironically humorous. Are you getting me there? Okay. Fine. Oh, millions of years ago, it’s a parable, it's a very old story, written some hundred years ago, where after creation, God decided that ‘Let me come and stay on earth. Let me come and stay on earth’. So He came down to stay on earth, but as soon as people started finding out that He’s here, He was deluged with complaints. Right. Yes. Someone came to Him and said, ‘Look, I've got a toe-ache’. Someone else would go and say, ‘I've got a headache’. Someone else would go and say, ‘My wife burnt toast this morning’. So all kinds of complaints from morning till night,
7. UK 77-1 morning, noon and night. So the poor old chap started getting tired. So he called his counsellors of wise men and he said, ‘Look, I need a rest. All these complaints, complaints, complaints all the time. Where can I go in hiding? Wherever I go, they find me. Where can I go to hide, just to have some rest?’ So one of the wise men said ‘Why don't you go on top of the Mount Everest? So God replies, He says, ‘Tomorrow Hillary and Tensing will come along and there will be a queue again of complainers’. (Gururaj laughs) Now, of course, in our sense of time, a million years seems so much, but in cosmic time it’s just a second. So then someone suggested, ‘Go and live on the moon’. So then of course He replied, ‘If I go and live on the Moon, fine, but Armstrong will come along and the same thing will start and they will start building rockets and all those things and try and reach me up there. And I will still have complaints’. So there were many solutions offered. Now, I can't remember if I was there that time! (General laughter). But nevertheless many solutions were offered but none of them were workable. So here one wise man said, ‘I tell you, my Lord, there is one solution. Do one thing, go and hide in man. And there they can't find you’. (Gururaj laughs). But then - ‘Go and hide in man himself. They can't find you’. But He says, ‘Look, some people will become enlightened and then they will find me’. So the wise man replied that, ‘When the man reaches the stage of enlightenment to find you within himself, then he would be at a stage where his complaints will cease, so you won't be bothered’. (General laughter) Yes. So that is the search, that is the search, the search is inward. Man has, he’s tired now, he is tired of searching externally all the time. He has been doing it from primitive man, when he started worshipping nature spirits and what have you, and if we study the history of religious development, we would find that there was an external search. Yet great teachers in the past twenty, thirty, forty centuries, have asked man to search inside, to find the solution. And we have reached a stage, in the world today, where the inner search has become more important than anything else. The greatest thing man wants today is peace, peace of mind, peace within himself. Now, through meditational practices, when one finds harmony within oneself - there are three aspects to man, physical, mental, and the spiritual. And through meditational practices, when a greater and greater harmony is reached within oneself then one becomes harmonious to the environment and very spontaneously, because the harmony within oneself is conducive to harmony without oneself. Like I always say, it is the nature of the flower to grow beautiful. But that is not the only thing it does, it also enhances th e beauty of the garden. So the world needs this more and more today, to find that harmony within oneself and thereby create a harmony without ourselves. And that is how a lot of strife and tension could be lessened, gradually lessened and we become happier, better people. Good. Question. Sorry.
8. UK 77-1 Questioner. I wish you would describe the internal method of shifting the emotion from the chakra to the chakra, the working of the mind to dismiss and to centre all activity in the chakra so the feelings can emerge. Aide ..... (Inaudible) Gururaj. Yes, this question is more in line with personal practices really, because there is not one royal road whereby certain energies could be activated. Now these various chakras that you have asked about, are filled with these energies, and the various chakras can contain certain blockages as well. Good. Now, where your blockages are or where John's blockages are, or Jack's or Jill's or Joan's is a very personal thing, and of course with our practices, there are so many of them, we show people how to remove the blockages from those areas, where they are so afflicted. But, one thing to be remembered, that one does practices to create a flow, a smooth flow through these various centres within oneself. Now, chakras are also in other terminology various states of one's unfoldment. And in that unfoldment, wherever blockages are, those blockages have to be removed. On close examination, the guru is able to tell you where the blockages are. He prescribes personal practices which are going to happen on our deepening Courses now. There is a special method we are going to use, special practices given. They could have not been given in the beginning, people had to be started off from step to step to step, and those that would be needing those practices, will be given those practices at the three or four Courses we are holding at the various places. And I’m sure you have been circularised by BMS of the Courses and most of you are coming to the Courses I believe. So that is where every individual's problems will be analysed in such a manner, whereby the smooth flow of energy or the heightened flow of energy would be explained and not only explained but prescribed to as well. And there are methods by which this would be done. If we want for these are energies to flow smoothly, we cannot just do it by theory. We have to practise and with the practice, appropriate explanations would be given to the person concerned. And one person's chakric problem is not necessarily another person's chakric problem. So the Counsellors would explain the various forms of blockages, the various types and how they act and interact with each other. This would be the subject on some of the Courses on which you would be hearing some discourses. On the Courses, discourses, sounds nice! (Gururaj laughs) Okay. Good. Fine. Gururaj. Someone down there wanted to ........ Aide. Would you like to come up here to ask your question?
9. UK 77-1 Questioner. Gururaj, there is much talk these days of a coming New Age or Age of Enlightenment. Please could you clarify that term for us? Gururaj. The question is that there is much talk of the coming of an Age of Enlightenment. Now, this has been a proposition made by some teachers in the world, and I personally have no right to deny or defy any one. I can only give you my personal views on the matter. Does enlightenment need an age? Does enlightenment, is enlightenment confined to time and space? When we talk of age, we are naturally referring to the time as our minds can conceive it. Good. Now, there have been teachers in the past, Buddha, Krishna, Rama, Christ, Moses, fine, great, great teachers that was Divinity themselves. With their teachings I do not see if any enlightenment, any age of Enlightenment has been brought up, brought about up to now. Good. Can we sincerely say to ourselves that man is more evolved today than he was two thousand years ago? In my experience I find that the same human frailties that were at that time are still here today. Good. An age of enlightenment to me would mean that the entire world, the entire society, reaches a higher stage of evolution. Now is that possible? Good. As I said, all these world teachers have tried. They never tried to bring about an age of enlightenment, but the teachings were such that one can become enlightened by practising their teachings. Now, I do believe in one thing, that enlightenment can be found on the individual basis and not on the collective basis. It has not been done in the history that we know. Will it be done in the future? It remains a big question mark. We can only judge from the past. And how the present state of man has been brought about, that we can very vaguely predict what could be in the future. But one thing is sure that every man in this lifetime can reach a very high level, if he is sincere and if he acts with a purpose towards that goal. Good. Now, when a certain section of society reaches a certain stage of evolution then there is always another section that is leading up to it. There is always another section that is leading up to it. Now, according to olden Sages, they maintain that in the path of evolution, one progresses the very, very sub-atomic particle progresses from the mineral, to the plant, to the animal and then to man. And within all these four general categories, we have millions of different kinds of species. Good. So if we are to accept that theory of evolution where the mineral will one day evolve to the plant stage and the plant stage to the animal stage and from then on to man stage, then it means that as a section of humanity, of man, reaches a certain stage, there would be another section coming up from the lower stages. In school when the standard six class goes to standard seven, the standard five class are coming to standard six. The standard four class are coming to standard five. And in that concept there will always be the law of opposites that we discussed just now. There will always be the good and the evil, the contradictions, the conflicts. I cannot see, I cannot see that within relativity that all conflicts
10. UK 77-1 will cease. Because in the Age of the Enlightenment, there should be no conflict whatsoever because in Enlightenment, in that light, there is no darkness. And studying history we have found that there never was such a period. And if we are to take the past as a guideline, will there ever be such a period? This remains to be asked. But through doing various practices from whatever movement or whatever form, I encourage them. I encourage them very much. I say 'The more, the merrier. Let them all work for the common good of man’. But everyone has to evolve and that evolution will take place individually, perhaps a greater percentage of the world's population, the possibility and probability of a greater percentage reaching a high state but then there is the backlog of developing that would come up. So there is a balance that will be required all the time. Darkness balances light. Day balances night. And in that manner I cannot foresee an age where the whole of humanity will be enlightened. I cannot foresee that. What I do foresee is this, that we are reaching a stage of calamity. At the turn of this century, the world is going to reach a great catastrophe. I have been saying this for many years. And a Nobel prize-winning scientist, Pauling I think his name is, Linus, Linus Pauling, also corroborates this statement that by the turn of the century, we do face utter, utter destruction. And this destruction will not be confined to planet earth alone. But through the planet earth, the entire solar system will be affected. So therefore we all work so hard so that man could develop greater love within himself and that this catastrophe can be averted. I have always been saying that we might have progressed in technology but how has technology been used? That is the question. The discovery of atomic power could be very beneficial in so many aspects of life but yet we know it has taken millions of lives away. Now today they are even experimenting with the DNA factor. They are experimenting with genetics and the laws that govern genetics. But will this be used in a good manner? When man concentrates on mind alone, on intellectual development alone, then intellectually we could become intellectual morons. We can. But if there is a simultaneous development, which happens with our practices, of the heart as well, where mind and heart grows together in unison then that greater awareness within us will not be misused, because with the development of the heart, there will be a greater love flowing. And the awareness that is achieved by the mind, will be empowered with that love so that it will not do so much wrong. But now this is something individual. When we talk of an Age of Enlightenment, we can say that, not society as a collective whole, but a lot of individuals, perhaps a greater percentage of individuals can find this great awareness of mind and development of heart, whereby we can become better human beings. But to say that this whole earth is going to be a heaven, I do not know. This earth can be a heaven for the individual therefore even our prayers or our practices we do, are individualised. And that is how we
11. UK 77-1 have to conceive of things. That is how we must progress. If I become better then naturally some benefit will be given to the world by my own betterment. And that would be a more practical way of looking at things. It would be more practical because it is logical. Perhaps the collective enlightenment of the whole world might turn out to be an assumption. We want to progress step by step. Lead thou me on, kindly light. One step enough. One at a time. And I think we can become happier. It is our birthright to enjoy the joy that is within us. Okay. Aide. I would like to ask a question which is connected to the one just asked. Many spiritual leaders have predicted that in this period of time the world will be in crisis at the end of the century .................. (Inaudible) How do you feel about .... (Inaudible)...., do we have the chance to avoid the worst of these things as we move towards the end of the century? Gururaj. Yes, yes, definitely. This catastrophe can be averted if man, a small percentage even, can start acting from the level of the heart rather than the level of the mind. The awareness will naturally expand but the emphasis should not be on the awareness, which is solely directed to technology, but a greater emphasis must be placed upon the heart, which is expressed in love quality. This is not a new teaching. This is an old teaching just put forward in different ways. Christ stood for love, Krishna stood for love, Buddha stood for love and compassion, and that is the message that is needed today. We go to churches, we go to churches and we pray but how much do we practise? That is important. How much do we practise? Now, if we try to force ourselves to love, we can become hypocrites, because you cannot force love. Love is a spontaneous quality that wells up within us, and if it is not spontaneous then it is not love. It is something contrived. Why is it contrived? Because we want to perpetuate our ego. When we perpetuate our egos then we do it with the motivation of need. And any need means wanting, any wanting means taking, which is absolutely contrary to love, which is giving. So when this quality develops in man more and more, through our meditational practices, I have had reports since I came here yesterday how beautifully people are growing in the heart areas, where they have become more loving. And that is the secret, to become. To have people love us, we just have to be loving. When we are loving, we are automatically loveable. That principle can never be denied. And I would not hesitate in repeating that principle over and over and over again. So that is what is needed. And by developing that, with the development of technology, and technology is going to develop more and more. There is going to be more and more scientific progress where, one day, the mind will be so expanded that here on this earth, I will not have to speak to you any more. There will just be an automatic mental communication. And if we are all still around, I will come and sit in this very hall and I will just close my eyes and you will close your eyes too and it is there. Okay.
12. UK 77-1 So the probability is there of reaching that stage. The probability is there of reaching that stage. But with the expanded mental awareness which is so, so much directed today to materiality, to mundane things and the quality of love between man and man is so, so forgotten and pushed far, far back into the background. What we are trying to do is bring that into the foreground. By bringing that into the foreground, the quality of life will improve and the catastrophe that is to be, can be averted. You give a knife to a loafer, what do you call them here in England? Yah, whatever, a Teddy Boy, or something. You give that knife to a Teddy Boy and he will go and kill someone with it. But give the same sharp blade to a surgeon, he will perform an operation and save someone's life. So it is same thing, the same energy. You require no more energy and no less energy. What we require is turning direction one hundred and eighty degrees. And therefore we say let us dive inside and draw from the beauty within. Draw it out through these spiritual and meditational practices and let it permeate our minds and bodies. And when it permeates the minds and bodies, by the activation of the core of one's personality which is the heart, then science can progress. But everything, every invention that will be made, every discovery that will be made, will he used with love. And love, true love can only benefit and that is how catastrophes can be averted. There are many inventions in the world today, in warfare, that are being suppressed. But any suppression can also lead to expression. It can lead to expression. So with a greater development of this heart quality, they will not only become more and more suppressed but dead and buried. That's what we want. So that is our aim, that is what we are trying to do, and each of us, all of us have that innate ability in us. For example, the workers in the British Meditation Society, they have that as their primary goal, to bring this message of love into practical life. That is why they teach. That is why they teach meditation. They teach how to dive within oneself. Now if you go and spend half an hour, if you go and spend half an hour in a perfume factory you will come out smelling like perfume. Yes. It’s inevitable. It’s inevitable. So why not enter this beautiful perfume factory that's inside? ‘Seek ye first the Kingdom of Heaven within’. And come out permeated with this power, so that we can truly love. And each and every one of us can contribute immensely to avert this forthcoming catastrophe. And this is no new message. I’ll say again, it's an old, old message. But now, as we said before, it is no use telling man, 'Love Thy Neighbour as Thyself'. It is good. It is a perfect principle. What we are adding to that, or rather that's the wrong word to use to add, you can not add to that principle, but there are ways and means how that principle can be activated, can be activated and could become spontaneously practical. So the methods of meditation that are devised, is to develop that heart quality and at the same time expand
13. UK 77-1 awareness, so that without effort, without trying, we become loving and loveable. So simple. There’s nothing to it really. Coming all this way to tell you this! You all should know it really. You all should know it. Questioner. ... (Inaudible) .... true love.. (Inaudible) .... but I have heard that people through devotion can also achieved tranquillity or whatever we want to achieve. The same way, meditators also have to force themselves to meditate. I don't know what your views are about it. Gururaj. Look there are many ways, there are many ways in achieving what is to be achieved. One can reach the goal through so many different paths. And for example our friend said through devotion one can achieve the goal. Very true. But that devotion can also become a meditation. To the street sweeper, that very act of sweeping streets can become a meditation. The cobbler repairing shoes, if he puts his heart and soul in it, he becomes so completely absorbed in it, that too can become a meditation. Fine. So where do you start? You start according to your temperament. Right. If your temperament has leanings to various paths then the best way for you to start is on the path to which you have a natural tendency. It could be the path of the intellect. It could be the path of devotion. It could be the path of just living a g ood life and not caring if there is anything else beyond this world but doing good and being good. That is also a path. And all these things, all these paths fall under the general title of meditation. Meditation is to find that oneness and harmony within itself and that is the purpose of meditation. So whichever path you believe in is good as long as the motivation is right, as long as the goal is right and that through your actions, you will benefit and at the same time others will benefit too, and that is a meditation. The aim of meditation is not half an hour in the morning and half an hour at night, but the aim of meditation is to live in that state twenty four hours a day, perhaps twenty five hours a day. Okay. Fine. Next. Questioner. I have a question about time and I find it difficult to even form it sensibly. When you were talking about the law of opposites, I was thinking about time and I thought perhaps there's not time and timelessness, perhaps there's time going forward and time going backwards. So if you go beyond time, that's timelessness. So it’s not time and timelessness, its time and time and timelessness. And I ask this because of a very interesting lecture that Amrit gave, which brought a new thought into my mind when he spoke about reincarnation and drew a cross-section of what he said could be an orange and put a centre into it and drew segments out from it and said perhaps we enter different incarnations, not in a straightforward line of progression but from a point of timelessness, into time. And then, I can't se e
14. UK 77-1 how there can be evolution without time. And I feel there must be something further to the days and nights of Brahmin, unless there is some kind of progression. Gururaj. Beautiful. It is a very beautiful question. I know exactly the gist of your questioner. Aide. Did everyone hear that question? I’d never repeat it. Gururaj. No. This is, of course the question is on time and timelessness. Good. Now the gist of the question was this, that you have to conceive of evolution in time. Now that is very true. It’s a very true statement, because what evolves? That which is timeless, that which is eternal, that which is immortal, that which represents that flame on our emblem, does not require evolution. It is a completeness within itself. What involves is the relative aspect of existence. The absolute aspect does not require evolution. The relative aspect requires evolution and that is measured in time. So both are true. Even the opposites are true. It depends from what angle we look at it. Good. If we look at it from the angle of the absolute then there is no time. Everything is timeless. But when we look at things from the relative angle, from our minds, then there is time. It took you half an hour to get to the Porchester Hall. Right. With what did you measure that? You measured it with your mind. What is your mind capable of measuring? The relative mind is only capable of measuring that which is relative too. But the conflict in your mind, the conflict that exists is the confusion of timelessness and time. Right. Both are true. There is time and there is timelessness but from which angle are we looking at it? Now, if we are looking at it from the relative angle then of course we do accept time. And the purpose of life is to go beyond time and reach that which is timelessness in other words, ‘From mortality, lead thou me to immortality’. From darkness of our mental conceptions of time, lead me to the light of the timelessness, which is beyond all mental conceptions. The fault always lies in our minds because with the mind, we are trying to analyse that which cannot be analysed. Who could ever define timelessness? To us it remains an assumption, until we reach there. In other words, its like trying to define Divinity. Now if man's mind was capable of defining Divinity then Divinity would become limited, because we, our definitions are from a limited mind. So we do not try and define that which is timeless, that which is eternal, that which is immortal. We do not try and define it, but what is possible for us is to experience it, and that is possible. So therefore as we said before the world is very mind-oriented. We must become heart -oriented, where all these experiences are possible. It is only the core of our personalities when we go beyond the mind, can we experience
15. UK 77-1 timelessness. Many of us go into meditation and a half an hour passes away like a second. That's in meditation. Let us come down to a more practical example. Boy and girl love each other so much, they spend five, six hours together and they feel that, 'We've only been together five minutes'. Why? Because the mind was taken away, withdrawn, and the heart was expanded. The heart, the core which is timeless, and that is Divinity itself, where, if six, five hours spent with one's beloved seemed like five minutes and the boyfriend doesn't want to say good night. Yes. So timelessness is not, can not be conceived via the mind but it can be experienced. It can be experienced within our being and our meditational systems are made for us to go beyond the realms of the mind. Now, it is not something that is acquired overnight. That is asking for miracles. Right. But a forceful power is given whereby some people take a bit longer and some sooner and some instantly experience that state which is timelessness. Now remember that time operates on a horizontal level. It starts at point A and ends at point Z. But timelessness operates on a vertical level. Do you see? So the two concepts are contrary to each other, one from the relative angle and the other from the absolute angle. Fine. One operates vertically, the other operates horizontally. It is a line. One has a linear progression. The other has a vertical progression and at the centre when two lines cross, at that point what do we find? We find ‘Now’. N.O.W. Yes. Are you following me? Am I? OK? Right. That is the crossroads that we are trying to reach. That is the crossroads. Fine. And then there is no past, and there is no future. There is no past, no future, but just the present. And in that flash of a moment, the entire eternity is experienced, at that point, the entire eternity. All infinity is experienced within ourselves, when we become successful of going to the vertical. It's quite a job, believe you me. (Gururaj laughs) Thank you. They tell me I have got fifteen minutes left. They rush me, you know. Questioner. Gururaj, could you clarify the relationship of mind with body and the essential self especially with relationshi p to achieving the cosmic consciousness state? Gururaj. Ah, is that a question or the title of a book? (Gururaj laughs). Good, nevertheless we can spend an hour on that, I don't mind. Aide. Did everyone hear the question? Gururaj. Repeat it.
16. UK 77-1 Amrit. The question was wants clarification of the nature of mind and body and the relationship to each other and in turn the relationship ... (inaudible)....... Gururaj. The relationship between - the relationship between mind, body and spirit? There is no relationship. It does not need to be related, because it just is. What is the relationship of heat to fire? The heat is fire. What is the relationship of cold to ice? The coldness is ice but in a manifested state. Good. Relationships only exist if there is a differentiation, if there is a separation. If we say the mind is separate from the body and the spirit is separate from the mind. Then we use these terms for want of better terms. Language is the greatest block to understanding. Please remember this, language being so limited, is the greatest block to understanding and realisation. Good. We can intellectualise and intellectualise and because of intellectualising, we got to use words. How do we think, for example? We can only think in words and pictures. Good. But when we experience the oneness of mind, body and spirit, we don't need words and neither do we need pictures. It is an experience at the crossroads between the vertical and the horizontal and all is known. We have heard of the intellectual faculty, the intuitional faculty. Now many of you have intuitional experiences , whereby without using any logic whatsoever you just know, you operate from a level of knowingness. And that knowingness comes about when mind, body and spirit becomes centred, where they interpenetrate each other so much that even interpenetration ceases, but a mergence takes place. Because even in interpenetration, one separates, one distinguishes, one discriminates. So when all that is gone, and we say, 'Not this, not this, not this' then only do we find ‘That’. From ‘This-ness’, from the denial of all ‘This-ness’, we reach ‘That-ness’. And ‘That-ness’ is brought to us, or we experience it intuitionally, which does not need any logic whatsoever. Now for every question there is, for every question posed by the mind, there is a mental answer. Fine. And every answer that is given can give rise, can give birth to ten more questions. Good. Every answer I can give you, I can question them all over again. Because they are now translated through the mind and translating them through the mind , although they come from deep within, although we have to use the vehicle of the mind, it loses its power in translation. We all know if we try and translate from one language into another language, so much beauty is lost in the poetry. Now that is just on that level but what when it comes to those deeper levels, when we deal with things that are beyond language, when we deal with things that are beyond language.
17. UK 77-1 So, at first we find the separation, mind, body and spirit. Good. Then we ask what is the relationship? And that is a very valid question. Because every reason we find to define the relationships, we will find another question. Then we deny the first answer. So forever we proceed, denying all answers. ‘Not this, not this, not this’. You are not satisfied. The mind cannot be satisfied. So there is only one way out, is to go beyond the mind. And there within us, wells up that knowingness that tells us, and I tell this to you from personal experience, that no separation exists and that this body, this mind and the spirit is all but one. Because of mental distinctions, we lay more importance upon one thing than the other. And of course we know we lay the least importance on the finest aspect, the spiritual self, because it is not knowable by the mind. Because it is not knowable by the mind, we put the least emphasis on it. We put more emphasis on the things that the mind knows. But when we reach the stage in our meditations, you will know. And this is true for all without ex ception that you will know intuitionally that the mind, body and spirit is all but one. Don't the Scriptures say, ‘Make your body a fit temple for the spirit’? Right. It says these things to explain to people that even the temple contains within itself that purity and the spirit in the temple becomes one with the temple. So that unity exists in the seeming trinity. What we define as separate today, one day we will find all to be just one. And that one can exist on different levels, different gradations, from grosser to subtle, more subtle, till we reach the subtlest. Okay. Fine. Now, of course Aide. One more question. Gururaj. We can, we can go Aide. .......... (Inaudible) Questioner. ...... (Inaudible)......whole of the solar system would it not be the end of an enormous cycle ...... (Inaudible) Gururaj. Okay. Right. There is nothing unavoidable. There is nothing unavoidable. For example, you sit down to a big meal, right, and you know it is not suitable for you so you can avoid the indigestion, by not eating the meal. Now, we know of the trend of the present world and how it is progressing and it can be avoided. Now, this planet earth or the whole solar system is just a grain of sand on the seashore. Good. But seeing that we are existing here, we should see that we try and bring as less strife and destruction to us and our brothers, to humanity at large. That is a purpose, that is an aim, that is a goal.
18. UK 77-1 Now when you say that it would be unavoidable, fine, that would naturally imply pre-destination or fatalism, that something will have to happen and it will have to happen. Now if we assume that attitude, then all of us will become fatalistic. For example we that are sitting here together this afternoon, we are searching for the deeper meaning of life. Why are we searching for the deeper meaning of life? If things are unavoidable to us, why search? Go to bed! Why search? So effort has to be made. Now when it comes to pre-determination it only means this, that there is a certain tendency. There is a certain tendency. You want to go from here to Surrey. Right. Now there are five roads leading to Surrey. There is a smooth road, a bumpy road, a washed-away road, whatever road. Right. Now it is for you to choose which road you want to take. Now choosing that road which you want to take, would mean free will. The tendency that is created there is Divine will. So, when man refines himself in all levels through his meditational practices, then he spontaneously will take the smoothest road to reach Surrey. In other words, he will be combining his free will with the Divine will and that is how the separation between man and God ceases. And that is where Christ has said, 'I and my Father are One', where Jesus had reached that high stage, where the free will had become one with the Divine will, and the free will was surrendered to the Divine will to say, 'Thy will be done'. So whatever tendencies there are would have to be fulfilled, but when there are destructive tendencies, which were created by the entire atmosphere then that atmosphere can be changed. That atmosphere was created because of a collective atmosphere of the people on this earth. Now, if something can be created in a destructive manner, it can be altered to a constructive manner. So therefore if, now the Divine will is always a good will - there is plenty of goodwill - so what we have to do is attune our free will towards a more constructive path and not a destructive path and when we are successful in that then destruction can be averted. So therefore it is said that man is a master of his destiny. A lot of ill has been done in this world because of this belief in fatalism. Fatalism, if not just regarded as a tendency but as an unavoidable fact, then that fatalism can prove to be more harmful than good. And it is because of fatalistic attitudes that many people, when they get a newspaper in the morning; they look at the fortune-telling chart first. Insecurity, that's what it is. Yeah. So, the catastrophe can be averted where free will can be joined up to Divine will. It is our free will to take the smoothest road instead of the bumpiest road. Okay. Fine. END
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