United Kingdom 77-9
1. UK 77-9 Gururaj. There is so much to do. Yes. Everything that starts has to end. The Course started and ends today. I suppose Shakespeare would say, judging from some of the tears here, ‘With sweet sorrow parted ‘. And yet, when the flower is a removed from the room, the fragrance can still linger. Fine. You have to say something? Do you have something to say? Questions? Aide. People did say we wanted to have a Rapid Fire question session today so that - there are so many unanswered questions, if we have five minutes for each one, or something like that. Okay. Gururaj. That’s how to do it. Did we cover everything by the way? Aide. We will start out with Paul over here. Questioner. Gururaj, the Sages say as one starts practising meditation and merging one's mind in spiritual energies, one starts to develop a wholeness. And this is manifested emotionally, mentally and physically. Is it not possible also that one’s health could also decline as well as get better through the practice of meditation and if so, the reason why? Gururaj. When an integration takes place between mind, body and spirit, then that very process of integration naturally would have effects on the body and the mind, because what you are actively doing is drawing from that infinite source of energy and drawing it in such a way, so that it could permeate our minds, bringing great tranquillity and greater balance, and also in our bodies. Fine. Now, it would be ridiculous to expect for a person suffering from a terminal disease for example, to be cured overnight because he or she is drawing on those spiritual energies. But one thing does happen is this, that in spite of how severe a disease could be, it definitely has a beneficial effect. Firstly, by the mental attitude, by the strengthened attitude of the mind and looking at the problem in a more positive way, a lot of the trouble connected to the organic disease could be removed. Now this applies to organic disease, right, and also by the activation of the subtle energies. Subtle energies, when activated, has to manifest itself physically also. I have said over and over again that the mind, body and spirit is just one continuum. There is no separation whatsoever. So whatever happens in the subtle self would manifest on the grosser self but then a person must not expect that if he has one leg, an amputated leg, that by meditation the leg will grow. Good. But, what will happen is this, that by strengthening his mind, by looking at his condition in the proper perspective, that one-legged man can find just as much pleasure and joy in life as the two-legged man and even more, because he is a meditator.
2. UK 77-9 So, the most important thing that meditation does for a person, is to bring about the harmony and self- integratedness. And when that is there the whole mountain can topple down and you won't bat an eyelid. We are born into a world composed of materiality. How we handle it, that is our problem. We do not look at outward circumstances only, because they are outward, but we look at the outward circumstances - could you give me five minutes? - but we look at outward circumstances how it affects us inwardly. Good. The search - I am going to talk faster - (Gururaj laughs) - so even in looking at the outward circumstances, how we relate it to ourselves inwardly, that is the important factor. And inwardly if we are strong then any outward circumstances, any outward circumstance would balance itself by itself because we are balanced inside. So that is how, when we come across a joyous occasion, we would feel a great intensity of that joy. And if we find an occasion which is not so joyous, we will feel the unjoyfulness of that situation, but having gained the integration within ourselves, we will recognise it at its true value. We will see that this circumstance is not joyful but I have now gone beyond the stage of being affected by it. You see how simple it is? If one of you write a book title it, ‘See how simple it is!’ Good title. So, so back to that question of Paul, that meditation does affect every aspect of our lives. Every aspect is affected, and the rough edges do get sandpapered off and in the sandpapering process, little frictions occur but they occur for betterment. Fine. Next? Aide. Richard, go ahead. Questioner. ............ (Inaudible). Gururaj. I can’t hear a word, love. How d’you pronounce it? Love – Luv. I’m trying to get it. Luv. Ah - luvv. That’s a lovely laugh, luvv. Good Questioner. Could you tell us a little about what is happening in other Centres in other parts of the world and tell is if it is possible for Centres to be linked ............. (Inaudible) Gururaj. Beautiful, yes. Oh yes, a lot of things are happening in other Centres. For example, Peter Bry is here, Dyalji, h e wi ll tell you about Denmark. And he is progressing very well and very steadily, so, and he reports to me that the meditators are finding great, great improvement in their lives. I was speaking to, I had an interview with one of his
3. UK 77-9 meditators this morning, John Burr, Burr, Beauregard, and he was telling me how his life has assumed such greater value and how life has become more and more beautiful for him. Now like that I’m just using one instance. Like that, there are so many, many, many meditators. Fine. In America its progressing very well, - Rishiji is doing wonderful work with a whole team of his workers, as is Amrit and Gita is doing such lovely work here with his team of workers, and without the team, the work cannot be done as we all know. Good. The same thing in South Africa, the same thing in Spain. You know Matilda very well that was here in England and she is going great guns, boy! Is that the way the Americans say it? Now like that, like that it would take me an hour to go into the details, to give you a full report of the various happenings. And then of course Sattish is here, he specially came from Australia to be with us and he is getting settled into a lovely centre. He has just bought himself a fantastic big house, eighty six thousand something - can’t remember – but nevertheless that is to be used as the Centre there and like that everywhere. Good. And perhaps in a year's time what would be very good, and this is an idea which many have expressed, is to publish a little book or an International Magazine. As numbers grow, we could have a monthly or a quarterly Magazine for the beginning, where all Centres will send in their reports and this will be published and given out to meditators, so that every meditator is well linked with every other meditator in the world and this would be something really good. So, it would take very - I have just giving you are a very brief idea, to go into details of how the Centres are doing would be a lecture on its own for a few hours. But I am very happy with the progress people are making, not only in developing their Movement, but also in the progress and the lives of meditators which mean so, so much more to me than anything else. I am responsible for every hair on a meditator’s head, every hair on a meditator’s head, and even if someone is a baldy! (General laughter) Nevertheless, we got to have some fun. Yes. Good. But you get my point. Good. Okay. Fine. Questioner. Gururaj, last night you were talking about why a child is born a boy or a girl and why a child chooses its parents. It occurred to me that as the figures for abortion are very high at the moment, I wondered does a soul choose a parent knowing that it's going to be aborted? What effect does an abortion have on the soul and you know generally what effect does abortion have on the soul? Is it sort of a thing done on purpose or is it an accident on the soul's part? Also sorry, does the soul have to then do another like, - I understand that after we die physically, we have quite a long period of time where we are very busy counting up our sums and seeing how much we still have to do - and so does that soul, after abortion still have an awful lot to do before it can be reborn into another family?
4. UK 77-9 Gururaj. Good. If the question took five minutes to ask, can I answer that in five minutes? Nevertheless, tell me one thing, would you justify abortion - your personal opinion? Questioner. In a very few cases it is justified, ........... (Inaudible) then I would justify ... (inaudible) so but, for myself under any circumstances and I personally wouldn't have it but I wouldn't like to put a judgement on other people. Gururaj. I just wanted to know how you thought about it. Good. Fine. Now, when a child is conceived, good, when conception takes place, and at the moment of conception, life has been generated. By generated, I do not mean that life was not there but the proper circumstances were brought together, whereby the generation of the already existing life can be brought into play. That happens at conception. Good. Now, if the parents decide to abort the child, it would not be any karmic tie on the child but, it would be it would be a karmic tie on the parents. Good. Now there too, in that tie, can we ask the question - am I getting through well on this, Keith? Am I, because I am not getting the feel of the mike. Aide. It’s not on. . Gururaj. Oh it's not - oh no - is that it. That is logic. Illogical logic. Beautiful, beautiful. Good. So, now, the motives, the motivation for the abortion is just as important as the act itself. Fine. Now, there are certain circumstances where it could be justified. Husband and wife love each other very, very much, and in their conjugal relationships, the wife has conceived. Later on when she goes for an examination and the doctors advise that the child has to be aborted because the woman might have contracted some disease which the child would inherit, or which could endanger the life of the mother. So there, an evaluation has to take place, the evaluation in the sense of choosing the lesser evil. What would be most important to the world? The life of the child or the life of the mother? Good. Now, taking the life of the child - it is life, - but taking the life of the child is necessarily evil, but in this world there are circumstances where one has to choose and of course it is always best to choose the path of the lesser evil. Good. We are mixed up in relativity and the balancing forces of good and evil will always be there, there is no doubt about it. Good. Now, so, if the path of choosing the lesser evil is to some measure justified, fine, but in that justification, there are still certain karmic ties involved for the parents. Now if the parents did not know that a certain kind of disease will develop, then there will be no ties, it will be non-binding karmically. But if there was the slightest foreknowledge, then they would be bound for taking a life. Now, what happens to the foetus is this, that that abortion was no accident for the foetus.
5. UK 77-9 Good. That very process of birth and not emerging as a full human being, might be just the experience needed by that soul, to feel a certain warmth or a certain kind of seclusion in the mother's womb. Now, when a woman conceives, every thought she thinks, every bit of food she eats, everything she does has an effect on the foetus. And as the foetus grows more, as the months go by, the greater and greater effect would be there. So, the child, even while in the foetus is learning, even while in the womb, the child is learning, and that might just be the experience the child needs so that it could take full birth in the next life. So, when we say that we choose our parents, we choose them for a specific purpose, we choose them for our evolution. Good. And this little experience of eight weeks or ten weeks or twelve weeks in the mother's womb, might be a very necessary experience for that soul. Good. So therefore when the soul is on the path of evolution, wanting to progress and goes through these experiences, it could be good for the foetus. But, perhaps, as we described the circumstances in which things were done, it could not be good for the parents. So, when it comes to justification of the action, the answer is yes, and the answer is also no. Every circumstances, every circumstance has its own particular value and every action has its own merit or demerit. And everything must be judged from an individual standpoint. Okay, fine. Some countries I suppose have a law where abortions are freely done and if it is done without proper evaluation or justification or choosing of the lesser evil, then I am not very much in support of that. There are certain moral values involved, certain scriptural values involved, and a lot depends on our own conscience. And if our own conscience cannot evaluate and is not clear about it then there are karmic ties that are formed. For one thing I know for sure, that if I can't give life, I have no right to take life. Okay. Fine. Next. Questioner. Can I just ask if you have any news of the person that we are sending healing energy to ........ (Inaudible) Gururaj. No, no. Who was it? It would be nice to phone. Who? Sidney, yah, yah. Oh yes of course. Did you? Voice. I did call and he said he was feeling very well, though he was asleep when the phone rang .........The day went very well. .............................. (Inaudible) Gururaj. And after he woke up, he felt well? Voice. Yes.
6. UK 77-9 Gururaj. Obviously he would not know if he felt well or not if he was asleep. Nevertheless even while a person is in sleep, it doesn't matter, those energies do go, they do penetrate him. I am glad he’s feeling well. He’ll feel better and better, don't worry. First class. Let your stay here be comfortable and worry free. The English people are good in their hospitality. Questioner. Gururaj, I would like to ask you if every incident and coincidence that happens to us in life has a lesson for us? Are there sort of incidents and coincidences that .......... (Inaudible) Gururaj. What a coincidence you asking that question? (Gururaj laughs) Well I do feel that there are incidences but I don't know about coincidences. Right. There are no coincidences. But if we qualify the word coincidences, ‘co-’ meaning ‘together’, is that right? ‘Co-’ meaning ‘together’, so there could be two incidences that could combine together which creates a third incidence. So in every coincidence, there are three incidences. Fine. One incidence combining itself to another incidence, and the combination of the two makes a third incidence. So, there is no coincidence in the normal interpretation of the word. Good. Fine. Every incidence, every occurrence, everything happening in our lives, as we know is not by accident. There is no such thing as accident. If I slip in the - if I have slipped in the bath this morning and hurt my head, it is not an accident. Circumstances - why are you laughing? Voice. .............I laugh because, if it was not an accident ......... (Inaudible) Gururaj. Not really, you know. You could say, ‘Oh I met that person accidentally and I fell in love with her’. (General laughter) So it is not always hurt, you see. Language is a funny thing, isn't it? Such a funny thing, language is. I wish I knew English better. Questioner. .............. (Inaudible) Gururaj. Oh, oh. Now, that’s a coincidence! (Gururaj laughs) Nevertheless there are no coincidences at all and anything that happens to us, is because we have signed up for it, as Amrit would say. Right. Yah. We, we have, we have planned it, we have planned it; we might not recognise the plan, we might not recognise the cause, which our action would take. We might not recognise the effect of the causes, because we as human beings have eyesight as far as our noses, but we don't have insight. When we develop insight then we can see around the corners. We can see what is behind the wall.
7. UK 77-9 We can total up all the causes and know in advance what the effect is going to be. You see? So then because we don't know what the effect of our actions is going to be, we call it an accident or we call it a coincidence. Me meeting you, for example, do you think that's a coincidence or an accident? Would you know that I have spoken to you all before even you met me, or even you were initiated? What force was there that drew us together? Do you think it's an accident or just a coincidence? Or do you think that there is some force that brought you to a level, whereby, as a piece of iron gets attracted to a magnet, there is a magnetic force, and that magnetic force that exists is no coincidence and it is no accident, it is there. Something happened some time, somewhere, some place that brings us together. So there are no coincidences, there are no accidents. Every incident is an incident influenced by previous incidences. And when two sets of circumstances combine, we call it the togetherness of the two sets of circumstances, creating a third set of circumstances. That's how it works. Very simple. Aide. Neil. Questioner What would you say about Hatha Yoga .............. (Inaudible) Gururaj. Oh yes, if any of you are doing Assanas, by all means do them, nothing wrong with them. Right. You limber up, you get an internal massage of the organs of the body. You stimulate them, nothing wrong with them. Very good. They could become very relaxing. But there is only one regret is this, that we do not have sufficiently qualified or knowledgeable Hatha Yoga teachers, I don’t know the position in England. Aide. I have something interesting to tell you. We have a person living down in the West Country now, who has been doing Yoga for twenty years and has been teaching for eight years. She’s very knowledgeable; she’s just become a Prep instructor, extremely beautiful person Gururaj. Very good. Beautiful inside? Aide. Yes. Yes. Oh yes. She’s, she’s beautiful inside, outside too. Gururaj. All the better
8. UK 77-9 Aide. Anyway, she was one of those people that when she did get involved ........ (Inaudible)... immediate feeling about coming home Gururaj. Beautiful. Aide. Now I was just thinking how she really wants to give herself to this now. And perhaps it would be nice if she would design a Course of Yoga Assanas and maybe she could travel to some Centres and teach them and eventually train a group of our Gururaj. Ah. Beautiful. Aide. of our people that would like to teach Yoga and they could go to her. Gur uraj. That’s an extra to the team. Beautiful. Very good. Now what I meant just now was from my limited experience of South Africa, not of England. You might have some wonderful Yoga teachers here. Now those Yoga teachers there in Capetown, there’s about a dozen of them only, I called up a meeting of them one day and we all got together. And they knew the Assanas, they knew how to perform the Assanas and they did it very well, but the knowledge was limited only to the physical. And most of the people that went to their classes, just went for physical purposes to keep trim, not to pick up weight, so that the size thirty two doesn’t become size thirty four. Things like that. That is not the purpose. It’s one of the side effects or what have you. The whole purpose of Yoga Assanas, if combined with meditation, those very Assanas could become a meditation itself, because in proper Hatha Yoga, the mind and the body do not act separately. They must act in unionism, in oneness, where the mind and the body realises its continuum and its oneness. Then those Assanas become very effective. Now if our meditators do Assanas, they’d be very, very much more successful in it because their minds are already tuned to a certain extent, whereby the combination of the physical Assanas with the state of mind, which a meditator is in, could produce far, far more beneficial results than just ordinary exercises. So that is valid, Neil. Yes. So if you are doing Assanas, do combine them but the rhythm should be there, where in the Assanas, whichever posture you are doing, the mind is combined in it and beautiful harmony and relaxation takes place and you can just float away. Just be careful of one thing, don’t do a very difficult posture where you are tied up into knots and transcend, you’ll be stuck there (General laughter).
9. UK 77-9 Aide. Michael Byer. Questioner. .........intellectual thing....... (Inaudible) ....... if the self ......books you recommend by Vivekananda........ how can there be freewill? I’m a little confused about it. Gururaj. Okay. Fine. Beautiful question, Michael. Right. In your confusion let us bring some fusion. Good. Right. One statement is equally true as the other. Good. From the Absolute aspect, there is no freewill, but from the relative aspect there is freewill, there is choice. And I said this the other day that if man’s mind can be attuned to the Divine mind then our freewill works in harmony with the Divine will, because Divine will is just the outline, the pattern of things that are t o hap pen. Divine will does not tell you that as you move out of that door, you are going to trip on that step. Divine will tells you that you are going to move out of that door. That is Divine will. Now freewill plays its part, where you be careful how you walk. And, and if you are not careful how you walk, if you don’t mind the step and you fall, don’t blame it on Divine will. Blame it on yourself because you have not been careful. Right. So in the care that is there in Divine will one must exercise the freewill and make use of the care which is already there and that is how the fusion takes place between freewill and divine will. That is how greater and greater harmony comes. And when there is the harmony between the Divine, between the big ‘S’ and the small ‘s’ then confusion disappears, confusion disappears entirely. Yeah. And that is what we are all trying to do through our meditational practices. That is what we are trying to do, is attune. We are alive and kicking and well on this earth and we don’t need to kick the bucket until the time is there. So, while we are alive and well and kicking, let us make the most and the best of it. And to make the most and the best of it, would be to allow our freewill to be fused with the Divine will and that can be done in so many ways. It can be done to a great measure through the intellect where we think, we assess, we evaluate. Good. It can be done through total self surrender where the small ‘s’, you don’t take much notice it, it acts on its own, the clock runs on its own but someone had to wind the clock. So the greater emphasis is on the winder of the clock and you say, ‘Thou art the winder, Thy will be done’. That’s the other path, that’s Bhakti, Devotion. The path of the analytical mind is Jnana Yoga. Good. Then Karma Yoga as I’ve said over and over again, ‘Do good, be good’ and be careful, mind your step as you walk through the path of life and there are many doors that you have to enter and has the Father’s house not many mansions. Yes. That is the path. We have to be always vigilant, always vigilant all the time. That is the spiritual path. Spiritual path, being on th e spiritual path does not say, ‘Go to sleep’. It says, ‘Be awake and doing’. Right. Good.
10. UK 77-9 And then of course the path we are following is a path which combines all these paths. Action, thought, devotion all are combined on this Royal road, this Raj Yoga, the Royal Yoga, that is what we are doing. A more balanced way I think, depending on people’s temperament. So therefore I always tell our Counsellors that there are particular types of people that we would attract and that’s what we want. The right type of people attracted to the right type of Movement or the right type of teaching, which is conducive to that particular person’s mind will help that person and in turn will help the growth of the Movement too. You can’t put a square peg in a round hole. That is for sure. Okay. Questioner. Gururaj, do you say the same thing ......... (Inaudible) Gururaj. Physically there is Pranayama? Questioner(Cont’d)................Pranayama ...... (Inaudible) Gururaj. Oh yes, yes, yes. Yes. Oh yes. True, true, very true. Beautiful. You see you have studied that. Lovely. Good. Good. Perhaps you could help when this young lady starts teaching in the various Centres, perhaps the Centre that’s nearest to you, you could be of great assistance to her. Very good. Aide. She’s in the West Country ...... (Inaudible) Gururaj. Beautiful. Beautiful. Beautiful. Aide. First we’ll hear Alex and then we’ll get yours. Questioner. ..............Karma........ (Inaudible) Gururaj. ‘Khaaarma’ (General laughter) Questioner .............. (Inaudible) Gururaj. Okay. I come from the South. We’re just two ends of the same stick. We’re all one. Matter of polarity.
11. UK 77-9 Questioner. Is Karma only karma when the attitude is identification for instance a person is evolved and going through life ........... (Inaudible) and things are happening physically and mentally and yet ......... Is it therefore free from karma ............... right attitude ... slave to karma ... (inaudible) Gururaj. Yes. The why and how. I see what you mean. Firstly karma can never enslave you and it could never deslave you. There is no such thing as karma enslaving you and there is no such thing as karma emancipating you. Karma is karma. Right. It is a fact that has to be faced. Karma can influence the events in one’s life, very true, but it is not necessarily enslavement. Good. When a person goes through a process of life and feels unstressed by the process and by the happenings in their life, does not mean that he is free from karma. Because the very experience of stressing or unstressing, - I don’t know who invented that word, it’s a terrible word. It is word some people invented from somewhere as an excuse. Someone is going through a terrible time, they say, ‘Ah, you’re unstressing’. And you ask them what is unstressing and they can’t tell you. The stress must be laid more on the proper way of living and proper practices. Right. So the person, I’ll have to use that word, okay, so the person who is going through life in an unstressed way, is not necessarily free of karma. What is happening there, is that he is reaping the rewards of what he has sown. He has sown good things, so he’s having an enjoyable period. Fine. Now the person who is very stressed, must know that he too is reaping the things which he has sowed. So the Bible tells us over and over again, ‘Thou shall reap what you sow’. Always, always, always. Now a good seed will always bring good food and a not so good seed will bring not so good food. We know that. Fine. So it is not a question of karma. Karma actually means, karma actually means action. Right. Now that action can be good or bad. Fine. In other words karma does not require any qualification on its own, it is a fact. But what effect the karma produces that is the qualification. Karma is a natural law. It is a law of nature, that because of that law of nature, it helps us grow. It helps to give us the experiences. Good. If you travel from here to London, it does not matter what model care you are using, your Rolls Royce or your little Austin Buggy, it doesn’t matter. The whole idea is to reach Damascus House for the next Course. Yeah. That’s the idea. That is the karma. The karma is to reach Damascus House and not which car you are using. The car we are using is the qualification only and karma is devoid of all qualifications. We add the qualifications, by misusing or properly using the law of karma. So if a person is stressful or not stressful, it has nothing to do with the law. It is how we operate the law. It is how we use the machine. Good. You can have a sharp blade and a Teddy Boy will hurt someone with it and the same sharp
12. UK 77-9 blade in the hands of a Surgeon, will perform an operation and save someone’s life. That karma is that blade, that sharp blade - how we use it and that too is where our freewill comes in. And if our minds are tuned and refined, then automatically it tunes itself with Divine will and that free blade will make a Surgeon out of you instead of a Teddy Boy. Okay. That’s how it works. Questioner................. (Inaudible) Gururaj. No, no. We want to return to nature and yet acknowledge science and technology. We want to return to nature and become natural and yet use all the discoveries of science and technology. We want to do that. Why discard science? Why? Science is very, very useful. It’s very useful. If it wasn’t because of science, you would not be here today. You’d still be walking from London to reach here. Yes, yes. Fine. So, so let us make the best use of what science can offer us. I am not against science. I’m not against science whatsoever. We need technology. We need technology. But what I am against would be the misuse of science and technology. Good. Use it well and everything is good. Dung lying in front of this door will create a great stink, but that same very dung used as fertiliser, will grow beautiful fruit or food. It is how we use things that’s important. And science and technology in this modern world is very necessary. If it wasn’t for science and technology, you sitting at the back won’t be able to hear me, - this microphone. Right. So, all these things are necessary. All these things can be used as parts to create the whole. And let those parts interpenetrate each other. Science has not discovered what the spirit is. Fine. It might not even discover it. There is a possibility that it might never measure in a test tube what the spirit is. But there is one thing, one thing it has done that the technological minded or scientifically minded people have found matter to such a fine level that they could very safely hypothesise in saying, that there could be still finer and finer levels. So even through the medium of science, one can be brought to God. For everything is useful. Everything is useful. Remember this, that if the sun can give light to the whole earth, one little lamp can give light to one little room. Everything is useful. Nothing is to be discarded including dung. (Gururaj laughs) Okay. Aide. Ted. Gururaj. Oh yes. Now, now, sorry, yeah, but Ted spoke to me outside and he says the weather is not so wonderful outside, so he can take photographs inside.
13. UK 77-9 Questioner. It’s better in here. Gururaj. Is it better in here? Okay. Ted, I’ll leave it to you. Aide. ........... (Inaudible) Gururaj. While they are arranging the photographic thing, I have to see five people Gita tells me, yeah, just for a few minutes each and then when you are ready I’ll be with you again. Meanwhile let us hand it over to Amrit to make his announcements. END
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