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1. U S 79 - 15 THE FOUR YUGAS GURURAJ: Something it goes sideways. Oh, is that the way? Thank you. [Gong sounds. Laughter] Good, fine. Shall we start with questions immediately? QUESTION: Guruji, I have to apologize. This is one of those nice books that you like so much. GURURAJ: One of those nice....? QUESTION: Nice books. GURURAJ: Ah, ah ha! Well if you pick up a book, you do not need to read all the pages. [Laughter] QUESTION: Beloved Gururaj: Recently you said that there would always be wars and disasters on Earth. How does this relate to the four stages of the world, the yugas, as described in Hindu mythology? Does the earth actually go through these stages and are they cyclical in nature that is, is the whole process repeated over and over, or does the Kaliyuga stage signify the coming of the end of the world? Has the world ever been destroyed before? Is it possible for the world to pass from Kaliyuga to Satyayuga without being destroyed? GURURAJ: Can I ask you something? Why do you want to know tha t and how is it going to help you? [He laughs] QUESTION: This is just intellectual curiosity. GURURAJ: Yeah. Of course, of course it is. I love a little leg pulling. You mustn't mind. If you want to know about the yugas, there is a nice book by Erich Zimmer, The Myths and Legends of Hindus. Now, in this book, you will find that the Kaliyuga lasts for something like 120,000 years; the Dwaparayuga, twice that; and the tretayuga, twice th at; and the Satyayuga, twice that again. Good. So, there's quite a bit of arithmetic there. And all those years put together I do not remember exactly what he quotes but this comes in Hindu mythology. Now, is mythology to be taken at face value? Is mythology to be taken according to the years that has been enumerated there, or should we regard it as pure symbolism? Good. Now, if we regard this to be pure symbolism, then we would find some philosophical

2. U S 79 - 15 truth in it, for all mythology symbolizes something. There is truth hidden in something. In ancient times, before the advent of modern science, sages conceived of the cycles of the universe, but, to put this to the simple minded people, they had to put it in form that could be understood, and th is was one of the forms. Who can prove to you today that Kaliyuga is going to last 120 years, or Tretayuga a quarter of a million years? But there is what it really means, that t his universe functions in cycles. Now, what does that cycle consist of? We hear so much about the Big Bang theory, that from the Big Bang, the entire world was created in seven days. Now this, you'd be surprised to know, that it is true. It could be seven seconds, where this entirety was created, because if you agree with th e Big Bang theory which scientists have now proven, then why could it be impossible for all creation not to have taken place in those seven days or seven seconds? But what takes time is, after the primal creation, after the expulsion in this Big Bang, aft er the expulsion of all these billions and billions and billions of atoms, what would take time in our sense of time time in our dimension would take billions of years to solidify itself. So, as those atoms, though born of the same substance, has ce rtain differentiations in its various gaseous or other components. And, as it travels through space, they also have the ability to duplicate and replicate themselves. And, because of the mixture of all the various forms of gasses which is life itself and in its solidification process, so many different forms have come about. So, like that, it would take billions of years from the primal Big Bang for the universe to reach the stage it has reached up to now or what we know of it now. Now, being cyclical in nature, what would happen is this, that there is creation which could be symbolized with a Big Bang we call it "manifestation" rather in metaphysical and philosophical terms, but for convenience, we use the word "creation." Now, when a th ing is created, it has to be preserved for the duration of a certain period of time, and then there is dissolution. Now this is symbolized in Hindu mythology, just like the yugas, by Brahma, the Creator; Vishnu, the Preserver; and Shiva, the Destroyer. N ow, I do not agree with the word "destroyer." I normally use the word "dissolver," because nothing in the universe, not even a particle of sand, could ever be destroyed, but it can be dissolved and sent back to its original elements. There is a belief sy stem which has also been proven today, that the entire universe is composed of five elements: air, water, fire, ether what's the fifth one? and earth. See, we always forget earth. And everything is composed of these five elements in various forms and various forms of gradations. So, at the time of dissolution, these various elements return back water to water, and earth to earth, and fire to fire they return back. Now, this returning back to that stage is known in Sanskrit as "pralay." Pra lay is a stage of equilibrium in the universe. So the world today, according to these mythological beliefs, is that we are in Kaliyuga. Now Kaliyuga is the yuga "yuga" means age is the yuga where great dissensions take place. In other words, great conflicts of the various forces take place. It is like clearing a road with a bulldozer and you're shedding off most of the dirt on the sides, but still there is so

3. U S 79 - 15 much that sticks to it that, as you come to the road, there is that little hill, that moun d of dirt. And according to the Hindu philosophers, that we are in this stage and we have to get rid of this mound. And, by getting rid of this mound of dirt, we would enter into the phase of [Satyayuga?], the yuga of truth, again the yuga of truth, a gain, which follows Kaliyuga. And then, from there on, you have the Dwaparas and the Tretayugas all following until we reach to Kaliyuga again. So everything happens in a cyclical manner. This universe had been there and it had been dissolved and recrea ted, and this has happened since beginless time. Now, the entire universe is never dissolved at the same time, but there are universes in the universe. So, at this very moment, certain universes are being dissolved have reached a certain stage of prala y and certain universes at this very moment are being born. So this carries on and on and on, and therefore, it is regarded to be eternal. Now, if we come back to the universe that we live in, this world is not the only world where human beings live. This world, too, is replicated and duplicated so many, many times. There are so many Earths if you would give them those names; perhaps they are known by other names which science have not discovered yet, but the mystic, in his deep meditation, wh en he becomes one with the universe, could see, feel, touch, be there, in these other worlds where similar people as us are living. There are other planets where even higher beings are existing than us. And those higher beings do not even need verbalizin g. That is, they operate entirely in such harmony that verbalization or the use of the left hemisphere of the brain is not so necessary. There is an intuitive quality where what we know to be mental telepathy is forever operating. So there are other exi stences that are even higher than ours. Fine. Now, in the creation and the dissolution what happens is this, that at the time of pralay, when the entire universe with its three gunas tamas, rajas and sattva and I've told you this before, that tamas is inertia and darkness; sattva is light and still; while rajas is the activating force. Now, it is because of the interaction of these three gunas tamas, rajas, and sattva that this universe is functioning, and, in its very functioning, motion take s place and, with motion, contraction and expansion is always there. If you can stand outside this little universe of ours, you'll find it in a state of flux, pulsati ng like this all the time, all the time. And, its rhythm is the simple form of pranayama most of you do: 4 16 8. So when you do that pranayama and do it well, you are regulating your system to the rhythm of this entire universe. It's just fluxing like this all the time. So at the time of dissolution of pralay, things do become of such a fi ner nature that the sattvic qualities override. The light of sattva overrides that of tamas, where the darkness and inertia is not destroyed, but disappears, like darkness disappearing when the light is switched on. And yet the darkness is there, because if you switch off the light, the darkness is there. The light cannot exist without darkness, and the other way around, as well. Now, when this happens, then the rajasic quality or the quality of movement, the activating force also becomes stilled. So then the entire

4. U S 79 - 15 universe is said to be in pralay which is not destruction, but all the elements are now operating in harmony and in a stat e of equilibrium. So now to reach the stage of equilibrium, everything in the universe has to reach a very re fined state, for without the refinement, there could be no equilibrium. Now, the function of the entire universe is the same function happening within you, and that is why they say that if you know truly the grain of sand, then you will know the entire u niverse. For within the grain of sand, the same principles are working within the human being the same principles are working and likewise Earth, the solar system, the galaxy and, of course, our little universe. And our little universe is nothing el se but a speck of dust in this vast eternity, in this vast infinity, and yet we are such a small speck of the speck. See. And yet on this little speck of dust, four thousand million people live that think that the entire universe revolves around them. D o you see how we minimize the value of the ego, because it is so self created and self destructive in the sense that it produces disharmony within us and those around us? Fine. Now, when the elements of our universe is in a state of equilibrium, then t here could never be total equilibrium, or total silence, because we are still dealing on the relative plane. All this is still on the relative plane. The Absolute is the on ly real stillness that one could think of. But in the relative plane, when this st age is reached, when this stage is reached of this equilibrium, there still remain within this surface equilibrium, very fine currents. And, over a period of many more millions of years and billions of years, these currents interjoin with other currents, and that interchanging of these currents produce greater and greater currents, and it reaches a certain height where another explosion occurs, and the universe is born again. You see. It is a cycle. Now to find this refinement to bring about pralay, coul d this mean that all the individual souls have now reached enlightenment? No. They have not. Matter has become finer, but the trace of ego will still be there for those that has not reached that stage, and it is these traces of man's ego that are the cu rrents in this state of pralay, the currents in this calm ocean. The ocean might seem so still and placid and so calm, but still there are currents in the ocean. So, when the next universe takes birth again in this explosion, those currents are activated , and those souls, those individual souls that has not reached total fulfillment, will assume grosser forms in its own atomic structure than those that have reached fulfillment . So, the finest would be intermingling with the grosser counterparts of the on e universe, and that is how the universe begins. And it is the admixture of the fine currents with the grosser currents that produces all this over millenniums, billions of years, and everything starts all over again. You see. So, this means this, that the spirit within you is eternal. Your mind within you is eternal, and so is your body eternal. You shed this body, and it just disintegrates and goes back into its various elements. But the essence of what constitutes the

5. U S 79 - 15 body is never, ever destroyed. So everything is eternal; everything is indestructible. But it changes form all the time; and, by changing form, man gives it a name. Why do we know this table to be a table? Because we have named it to be a table. We could have named it a chair, and we could have named the chair a table. You see. So, the forms that are created have to be named, and man names these forms for expediency so that the world could carry on carrying on. So then the entire structure could be viewed as nothing else but name and form, and yet the essential quality, the essential energy that condenses itself into matter, is but the same, for there is no difference between energy and matter. Matter is energy and energy is matter. We call it matter because it has assumed a gros ser form which the five senses can perceive. You can touch the table, see the table, even hear the table because there's an emanation there of sound. It is resounding all the time. You can smell the table. So, where anything is perceived by the senses , we call it matter. Then, with scientific instruments, finer matter can be perceived, but the finest of the finest relative matter cannot be perceived as yet by modern technology. So, when we come down to the essence of matter, it is nothing but energy. So this universe is none else but energy viewed in different form. So we do not attach so much importance to form. We attach importance to the essence. If you take clay, and with one clay you build a boat with one piece of clay and with some more clay you build a house, and you say, "Oh, that's a boat and that's a house;" really speaking, it is a clay. The essence of it is clay, and that is how this universe is constructed and goes through these various yugas. Now yugas means only these ages me an only one thing: degrees of refinement. Kaliyuga, at a very gross level, and [Satyayuga?], at a very fine relative level, and the two yugas in between are there in varying degrees of fineness or grossness. So there would be, there would be evolution in the field of relativity, but never evolution in the field of the Absolute. But now, the energy which is functioning in the universe what is the energy behind that energy to be energy? That is the question. Can that energy exist alone? Is it self s ustaining? Finest, relative energy is it self sustaining? It is not self sustaining. It is not self effulgent or self energy producing. Being relative, even at its most finest level, is nothing but a reflection. So relativity, or all that is relativ e, being a manifestation of the Manifestor, is only but a reflection of the Manifestor. So all these universes that come and go is nothing but a reflection of the Manifestor. And how real are reflections? The reflections are unreal, and yet they are real . Because, if the Manifestor was not there, if the reality was not there, where would the unreality of the reflection come from? So therefore the manifestation is just as real as the Manifestor.

6. U S 79 - 15 When you look in the mirror, the reflection you find mirror ed there is real as you are real, but in a different form, in a subtle form. You can photograph your image in the mirror, and the film would prove the validity of the mirror and the reflection in the mirror. So that is why, that is why certain theories re gard that is why we do not agree with all the theories in the world. Vedanta, for example, goes to the stage of regarding the entire universe just to be maya, or an illusion. But the illusion is real, t oo. The illusion is real, for you cannot divorce the Manifestor from its manifestation. I always say God exists because you exist, and you exist because God exists. They are inseparable. So as long as there is a Manifestor, the manifestations will occur all the time. It will go on, and on and on. Now , if the Manifestor is so still, where does all this activity come about? Where does all this motion come from in the manifestation? So, could it be that the Manifestor, after all, is not still? One can ask that question. That within stillne ss, is there movement, or is there stillness within the movement? Is there God sleeping and so still, or is he acting forever? [Bell Ringing] Good. Now, Divinity is a combination of both. Divinity is a combination of motion and non motion, because, if the Manifes tor was totally still, then that which manifests from him must be totally still, too. But what brings the motion in the relative life, in relative existence? So there must be an area within the Manifestor that activates its own manifestation, and this is how it works. The sun, to use an analogy and all analogies are never complete or never accurate. The sun seems there so still in the sky, and yet the heat and that light which it sends down here is full of activity, for the heat has so much atomic a ctivity in it, the light has so much activity in it. Then we think that here, from the stillness of the sun, so much activity comes. Or th e stillness of the flower so much activity comes as fragrance. Yet the best analogy I like to use is the spinning top: when it is at full speed it seems to be standing still, and yet, in the highest vibratory motion. And that is Divinity. So, that is the silence of the Absolute, and, when we get emeshed in the motion of that silence, we say that Divinity is also ac tivity. You see. So, our path is this in this whole cycle of the yugas: our path is to find amidst all the motion this stillness. And the on ly way that can be done is to clean ourselves up, get ourselves into a vibratory height, all the chakras and all functioning in a state, in a high state of vibration so that it seems totally still. And when you reach that high state of vibration and find that stillness, you find yourself one with God, where the motion of the vibration merges into the stillness of th e Absolute. So nothing can be separated from each other. It is all one. Motion and non motion is one; black and white is one; sky and earth is one. There is no separation. It all functions within the oneness of this vast ocean. And, in the stillness of the ocean, at times when it is still, the currents are still there. When it is turbulent, the currents are still there. For everything is, is, is just is. You see.

7. U S 79 - 15 That is why to bring all this into practical terms we have to be in activity all the time, f or it is heightened activity that brings the stillness. And you can experience this in daily life. If you really want to have something done, give that job t o a busy person and it will be done. If you give the job to a person who has plenty of time, tha t job will never be done. If I ask Sidney to do something, although he is the director of companies and running big concerns and factories, I am sure it will be done. If you want to give some activity, give it to a busy man, because his life is so precise , methodical, systematic as systematic as the universe runs everything in total precision. You see. When I was in business, people started work at 9:00. They dare be one minute late! Because I am half an hour earlier than 9:00, why must they be one minute late? And they'd say, "It's unforseen circumstances." So discipline brings about this heightened motion, and this heightened motion brings about the stillness. You see the circle? You see the cycle? And the whole universe function in the sa me cycle. So therefore, from the stillness of pralay, the motion begins; and as the motion becomes more and more heightened, it reaches the stage of stillness again. It is not destruction, but a creation of an equilibrium which could be called dissolutio n of grosser elements to its finer state. Now this, I practice every day practically every day. When I receive a lot of letters from people and there's no letter that I would ever ignore. Some people write 20, 25 page letters which could be condense d into one page. You know, I do not need to know the whole life story and, you know, all that and "I had three miscarriages," and this and I don't want to know that. I want to know what your problem is that can be stated in one paragraph. So I shift through the day's mail, and I've got to read thousands of pages a month can't even get down onto books. Nobody ever worries about Gururaj's eye drops, you know! Then I go into a certain kind of meditation. Now, in this meditative state, what I do is t his: am I giving my secrets away? Good, because I want you to become the same. That is why. I go into a heightened state I go into a certain state of meditation where every chakra starts functioning at its maximum speed, at its maximum vibratory lev el. And, going into that state, the energies become so powerful that I could direct them in absence. There's no such thing as space or time in that state. The person is there and directing those energies to help the people. But one thing is sure, that the vibratory level of the body goes so high that, even if you stand 3, 4, 5, 6 feet away from me, you'll feel heat as if you're standing near a fire. You see. So that is why we say all this has come from fire. You see. The whole universe comes from fi re, and from fire came all the other elements. So we are doing this all the time. The whole universe is functioning in us all the time. Billions of cells are created ever y moment of the day. They are preserved for a while, and they are dissolved to recr eate themselves. In our own bodies this is happening. Creation, preservation and dissolution is there all the time, and, in the same way, the whole process is happening on a larger scale in the universe. I heard the bell ringing quite a while ago. Are w e okay for time? Good, fine. Okay, good.

8. U S 79 - 15 ****END****

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