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1. US 82-5 RAPID FIRE CHELA: This is a satsang with Gururaj Ananda Yogi, U.S.A., 1982, number 5, recorded at U.C.L.A. CHELA: Beloved Guruji, could you speak to us about the significance of chanting and gong meditation that we do in group practices? GURURAJ: In chanting ... (I think you better fix this for me. OK.) Now the chant is very scientifically based. The sounds you utter aim hrim krim chamunda ye ve che che; aim hrim krim chamunda ye ve che che those words have no meaning but just taken for the sound value. Now by using certain kinds of sounds the vibrations can be lifted. In other words, what we mean by lifting is this: they could be brought to a greater momentum, rotating much more faster than the normal usage of words. Now when this happens, when you change the atmosphere into a higher vibration, you are uplifting the atmosphere. In other words you get much closer to finer relativeness of life and of the environment. That is one reason. The other reason is this, that you learn to separate the big "I" from the small "I." After about three rounds of chanting when you really get into it, you will find that the chanting just goes on automatically, and you, the real you, the higher you, becomes the observer of the chant. So through this practice it is brought in daily life where anything that happens, you do not get involved in it. But you could stand apart from the happening or situation and become the observer. Now when you become the observer and not involved, then any happening or situation does not give you the suffering or the misery which it would otherwise give you. Another thing that happens when you learn to separate the big "I" from the small "I" is this: that all the deeds or all the thoughts thought and done by the small "I" are not karmically binding because of the power of the chant and the heightening of the vibrations does not allow those thoughts and acts to become embedded in your mind which we call samskaras. And that is how gradually you free yourself from samskaras. You have samskaras as you are, and through spiritual practices you remove those impressions and samskaras. But at the same time we do not want to add more to it. So chanting helps you not to add to the samskaras which you have. What's the sense of doing spiritual meditations, reducing the samskaras and at the same time you're adding more to it so it remains the same? So what we are doing in purification of ourselves or clarification of the ego self, we are lessening the burden of samskaras. And this is what chanting helps you do. In Las Vegas I told the story I don't know if I told it in Los Angeles I was invited as a guest at someone's home, and my room was upstairs. So early in the morning I heard the chant floating up. "Aim hrim krim chamunda ye ve che che. Aim hrim krim chamunda ye ve che che." And I was thinking how wonderful this hostess was.

2. US 82-5 She starts her day with the chant, with the clarity of mind. And so beautiful it is. So when I came downstairs for breakfast, I told her that this is very good. So she says and meditators, true meditators, are normally very truthful, yes, normally very truthful and she says, "Guruji, I must admit something to you. I do three rounds of chanting for a hard-boiled egg, and one round for a soft boiled." [Laughter.] Now there are other benefits to chanting also. And the other benefits are these: that the words are so precisely worked out, the duration of time is so precise, that you have complete exhalation. Now as any medical person will tell you that exhalation is more important than inhalation. Inhalation happens automatically and exhalation too. But if you can empty your lungs totally, then your in breath would be deeper. So it is also a form of pranayama. Now by this total expelling of air with this chant when you chant, you'd find think of it tomorrow when you chant again you'd find you're not breathing in through out the entire phrase or whatever you call it. You're breathing out. "Aim hrim krim chamunda ye ve che che." It's out, out, out. Do you see? So it, by the exhalation, total exhalation, you discard and get rid of a lot of toxins in your body. So the chant is very important. There's another thing you can do with the chant is this: when your mind is troubled with some worry or thought, switch over to a chant. If you're alone, do it aloud. And don't do it in your main street in Los Angeles. They might think you're kookie. You can do it in your mind. And you'll find the power of that hurtful thought just dissipating itself because you are redirecting the energy of that negative thought into something else by heightening your vibration. And then you introduce the positive thought gradually. And this is what I have against Norman Vincent Peale I would challenge him on any platform that he says convert a negative thought into a positive thought. But you've got to have a neutralizing factor. Yo u just can't switch over. It's not like a light switch. So when the negative thought is neutralized by a chant in your mind o r by pranayama or by your mantra, then you'd find it much more easier to look at the brighter side. Do you see? So chanting has all these various benefits. It is not something new we are doing. You'd find it in most religions. Practically in all religions. Our difference is just this: that I've made a very great scientific study of this subject. The duration of the chant apart from the exhalation which is beneficial to you physically it is also a great controlling factor of thought. Now we think we are thinking for half an hour at an end. We are not. the mind is only capable of retaining a thought for a certain period. When you say the mind wanders from one place to the other, that is the reason. The thought formation in the mind only lasts for a certain period. Fine. It is like a cinema film. If you look at the cinema film, although it seems continuous on the screen, it is made up of frames, different frames. But because of the mechanism that is used, the rotating wheel on the projector, it makes you see as if it is continuous, and in the same way you feel that your thought is continuous. It is not. It is like those frames of the film. So

3. US 82-5 when you are doing the chant the thoughts that go in the back of your mind, you can see them not as a continuity, but you can see them frame by frame. And when you can see them frame by frame, you will realize that this is all just so momentary and all little fragments put together. And when you realize that they are just but frames of fragments put together, then you will realize that that thought of yours is not really as valid as you would make it out to be. And by knowing that your misery becomes less. Suffering becomes less. You become the observer. You watch the film playing on the screen. Do you see how the deep ranging effects of something so, so simple? Spiritual practices should always be very simple. Many people evolve techniques and what have you and make them complicated for one reason only: the more you make it complicated, the more profound it might sound and the more they can charge you. Yes. Do you see? So spiritual practices are the simplest things because Divinity is simple. It is we that compound it, and add on to it. And my favorite saying has always been this: "It is so simple to be happy, but so difficult to be simple." Do you see? So that is where we have to reach, to the primal quality or primal thing within us which is nothing else but simple simplicity. And simplicity also implies innocence. Therefore, the scriptures would say, "Become as innocent as a child, then only shall ye enter the kingdom of heaven." So that is what we want if we want to wash off this dirt and this dross, the complexities that we ourselves have added on to us and reach back to the real simple selves that we really are. And when we reach that, we have become one with the divine source. We have reached the source. OK. Now what is the purpose of the gong meditation? Many people that are not properly established.... Now this is a Tibetan form of meditation. In Tibet, even when you sit down to a meal at the monasteries, you'd find while you are eating there's always some abbot or whoever, a lama, chanting away all the time. In the absence of that.... The purpose of the chanting is this, that this food is divine, I am divine, and I'm combining divinity to divinity. So that at first there's duality: I and food. Now the food is ingested in me and digested in me and assimilated in me. And so likewise let Divinity and I be assimilated within each other, a oneness. In the absence of that, they use a gong. Now what happens is this, that many people that are not well established in the mantras, the gong helps them because when you strike the gong, there is a reverberation. (Strike it once, Love. There's a thing there. Strike it loud. CHELA: Loud? [Gong sounded]) GURURAJ: That is what must happen to your mantra. Do you see? You just don't say apple, apple, apple, apple, apple, apple, apple, apple, apple, apple, apple, apple. No. No. Apple, apple, apple, apple, apple, apple, apple, apple, apple. So this teaches you how your mantra must proceed when you meditate. You go with that reverberation, using your mantra until it goes finer and finer and finer until it goes beyond the mind. And then a thought will come up. Let the thought play out. Again the analogy of the cinema screen. Watch the thought, and as the thought ends, you effortlessly

4. US 82-5 pick up your mantra. And as the reverberation we heard on the gong, let it float away. And as it float away, you dive deep within yourself. You reach deeper layers of your mind. That is where the beauty is. You see? It is so they call it mystical, but it's so scientific at the same time. So systematic. So scientific. So this teaches a person on the courses ho w they must meditate. Getting together on courses are very important. Everyone is bent to a certain ideal, a certain higher thought. And when everyone are bent, their minds are attuned to a higher thought, an atmosphere is created whereby you benefit so much. I personally am not in favor very much of people commuting. Coming to courses and going home and coming the next day and going home that night. I tell you what happens. You are in this atmosphere, an uplifting atmosphere, where spiritual practices are done. The whole atmosphere is changed. So much love flowing between each other. You hear some words of wisdom perhaps, if you understand them at it's proper true meaning. So there's a regeneration of the mind. We look at things from different angles which you might have not looked at before in that similar way. So our perspective changes. Through the talks we give here, love is given a chance to express itself among the meditators. And there are many, many other benefits. So by going home and coming back the next day, going home and coming back the next day, it breaks it. You get into a different atmosphere at home or outside or whatever. It breaks that. So it is always good, wherever possible, to be in the course if it's a three day course or four day or five day to be on the course all the time. Mix aro und with the other meditators. Have discussions on various topics. "Oh, Guruji said this morning. Now let's see. Now what did he mean? Let's put our heads together." Although I try and bring down the profoundest truths in it's most simplest form for all to understand. And one thing you will find and this was told to me by hundreds and hundreds of people and it is this, that "I listened to a tape of Guruji three years ago and today when I listened to it, I find something new in it. Perhaps Guruji has grown." [Laughter.] You see? So it is so important. But because we haven't got sufficient numbers, our courses are so small. And actually as far as I am concerned, they are not really economically viable for A.M.S. Large fares have to be taken into account. Coming from South Africa it costs nearly three thousand dollars. So for that reason only do I allow this commuting business. OK. Fine. It can't be helped. As long as we have more people. Every bit helps. So in the future if you can, if it's physically and economically possible or if your job allows, whatever, be on the course, the full course, all the time. Be with me all the time. My door is never locked. It's always open. Walk in it any time you like. Of course they have devised a system of appointments so that there's no confusion. But in the middle of the night I can be knocked up, yes, for any problem. I am here to serve. That's my life. That's my mission. To teach love and peace and not only by words but also by using a corkscrew and opening up that heart. And you'll be surprised how it gets opened. That invisible cork screw I use. Pull it out. Do you see?

5. US 82-5 So it's always an uplifting experience, and that's what they tell me. And I've conducted hundreds of courses around the world. And that is the reaction I get. And thanks to the mercy of God that He uses me as His instrument. I always say I'm like a flute. Hollow. It is He that blows for you to enjoy the divine music. That's all. Good. Next. (Does that answer yo u sufficiently?) JAMMU: Guruji, in a talk the other night you said that we cannot get rid of our troubles and samskaras in this life. And you further said that in effect we are stuck with our unpleasant behavior patterns. And in fact we should concentrate on our more pleasant ones and help them to grow that so they will overcome the unpleasant ones. And yet just a minute ago you said that, for example, group practices and chanting will help us with our unpleasant samskaras. So please resolve this conflict. GURURAJ: Beautiful. You cannot get rid of samskaras. You cannot destroy them. They are with you all the time. But by heightening the vibrations within your system through group practices and spiritual practices done individually, you take the sting out of the samskaras. You create a kind of shield where those miserable thoughts and samskaras do not affect you as much as they would have affected you if you were not doing your spiritual practices. They'll always be there. To live in this world, you're living in a world of conflict. And it is only conflict, the law of opposites as I call it, that keeps this universe going or else this entire universe will collapse. But how can we minimize the effect of the samskaras? That is what we are doing. The samskaras can be dissipated. And when they are dissipated and thrown off by powerful spiritual practices those samskaras are not destroyed but they will go to the areas which is most conducive to them. Right. A negative, very negative person will attract to him or her those samskaras that you have shed off. So they are not destroyed, but they will attach themselves to where they belong. So that is why when you are negative, to use that word, you become more and more negative because you have become now the magnet of all these forces in the universe. And you will attract that whatever you are like. Therefore, we have the saying, "Birds of a feather flock together." So the heightening of our vibrations getting the energies well balanced within ourselves, physical, mental, and spiritual will eliminate the suffering of those samskaras that are there. "Whatever you sow, you will reap." That is an unalterable law. But by using good fertilizer, nurturing, watering, you can produce a better plant instead of a dying plant. So those samskaras are worked off. Now rather than having them translated into their physical equivalent and suffering more thereby, we do spiritual practices where those very same samskaras, the very same causes will have their effect, but the

6. US 82-5 effect will not be so severe that you suffer, that you would suffer so much. That suffering is lessened. That is how it works. So it is not a contradiction. The one statement is complementary to the other. Do you see? Next. CHELA: Actually I had two questions. Depends on how ... Looks like nobody else has any. I can ask them I guess sequentially or ask them both now. GURURAJ: Ask one at a time. CHELA: OK. If I can remember them. Oh, yes, the first one was: we make a great deal, particularly in California, of diet of one sort or another, of different types of foods, alcohol, et cetera. Does any of that sort of consideration, beyond reasonable moderation, have any independent spiritual or physical impact? GURURAJ: Diets are a very individual thing. One diet could be good for one person, and another diet could be good for another person. Fine. They have to be worked out by a qualified person who knows about diets, a dietician. A person with a certain kind of illness might have to go on a certain diet, and another person with another kind of illness would go on a different kind of diet. Now dieting has to do solely with your physical body. After all, what is your body made of? It is nothing else but food. Right. That food is eaten and then excreted. Those excretions are used as fertilizer to grow food. Now when fertilizer is used, it becomes part and parcel of the food which you eat again. So in reality what are you eating? [Laughs.] So everything goes in cycles. So even the excrement is important. That too is good. Do you see? Now all these things has nothing to do with your spiritual self. The spirit forever remains pure. It is unstained. But the more you do spiritual practices, you will find that your food requirements will become more and more finer. Now many people ask me, "Guruji, must I become a vegetarian?" I say, "No. What for?" You don't need to become a vegetarian. That's what all the other gurus say: you don't smoke. You don't eat meat. You don't do this. You don't sleep with your wife. You don't... you know. That's unnatural. The entire universe shows you that you do not need to become a vegetarian if you do not have the inclination to do it. And anything which is forced upon you by yourself or by the opinions of others can only be harmful because you would go through so many inhibitions and so many repressions that you could suffer of health. Mental health could suffer because you are forcing yourself into things.

7. US 82-5 If you go to a finer, more refined sort of diet, then that must come spontaneously from within you. That you just don't care for it. You don't like it. And like that you proceed. But to repeat again, it has nothing to do with your spiritual self. It has only to do with your grosser body. Now I've always said that the body, mind, and spirit is a continuum; the body at the grosser level and the spirit at the finest level. Good. So if any grossness goes into the grosser body, it can never touch the subtle level of yourself or the spirit. People talk of nonviolence, not killing animals to eat. Now this too has become a fallacy. It's just overdone, exaggerated really. The Indian scientist, Roy, he discovered the heartbeat in a cabbage. He found a heartbeat in a cabbage. Everything contains life and everything contains consciousness. Even a stone has its form of consciousness or otherwise a stone will not change. It is not only the external circumstances or the environment that changes the stone. But the stone changes from within itself because if you study the stone, you'd find millions and millions of atoms and the molecules with all its electrons and protons circulating in motion all the time. And that motion is life. And that life is consciousness. But I do say anything you do, do it in moderation so that it does not harm your body. If you want to have a drink, a glass of wine with your meals, nothing wrong with that. Right. If you want to have a little night cap before going to sleep, nothing wrong with that because whatever so called toxin there is in it, your physical mechanism has the power to eliminate those toxins. But that does not mean that you'll start eight o'clock in the morning boozing until sleeping time and wake up at eight again and start boozing again. Do you see? That is abuse, not use. So use whatever you want to, but do not abuse it. For although your spirit is untouched, you're harming your physical body. Now I know people in the West and in the East also. Don't think Eastern people are vegetarians only. Out of the whole of India, seven hundred fifty million people, there is only eight percent who are vegetarians. The rest are meat eaters. All the famines that were in India ... Pandit Nehru, the late Pandit Nehru, the Prime Minister, said it over the radio and in ne wspaper reports that India's surrounded, three quarters of it surrounded by sea and why not eat the food that comes from the sea, meaning fish, instead of hunger and famine. I've been to various ashrams, like the Ramakrishna ashram, and there fish was served and light meats were served. I was there. I stayed there. I should know. You see? So it has nothing to do with your spiritual progress or your spiritual self. It has nothing to do with that at all. But try and consume things in such a way that it does not harm your body. Now I know people today. They have meat three times a day which is not so much protein is not really necessary. They have bacon and eggs in the morning, and in the afternoon for lunch they'll have a hamburger, and then when they come

8. US 82-5 home to dinner, there might be steak and chops and I don't know what all. I'm not used to these things so I can't tell you much about it. So three times a day is too much. To me it seems too much. So enjoy yourselves. Enjoy. Enjoy. Enjoy. After all whatever you are putting into your stomach is also divine. You are divine, and the mixture of both is divine. From fullness comes fullness. And fullness goes into fullness. And there is onl y one fullness. So if we develop the idea of doing things according to our needs... our real needs, not assumed needs. An alcoholic will think that he needs to drink from morning until night. That is not a need. That's not a need. That is a slight aberration of the mind where a compulsion takes place, where he just cannot do without it. His whole body cries out for it. Every cell in his body, his entire well, Robin would know as a doctor more about this than I but his entire system cries out for it. But if he has the determination to cut it out, he can because he is destroying himself. He's destroying his mind. Can't think clearly. He loses his job perhaps. He loses his family. Can't support them. And because of this so many quarrels ensue in the house. And more and more problems are created. And problems have one queer habit: they always multiply. They have that habit, multiplication, and not subtraction. Do you see? So these things don't harm the spirit at all. There must be no craving for it. So you are in a party with friends. It's nothing to have your glass of champagne, but you're not craving for it. You're not attached to it. It does not become a compulsion to you. So enjoy. But in the right way. For all this is there for man, created by man for man. So let it be used for one's good and not for one's detriment. I know of a cardiologist that advised one of his patients Professor Beck; he is a personal friend of mine he says, "Look, when you reach home after work, sit down. Relax. Have one or two scotches. Unwind. It'll be good for you." And when Professor Beck asked me about this, I said, "Good. It's right. That's right. Nothing wrong." Do you see? Most of the medicines you drink, three quarter percent of it is alcohol. Cough mixtures contain a percentage of alcohol and like that. So where do you draw the line? Be honest and be sincere and do things according to your own personal, sane need. Right. Fine. CHELA: Next question. Actually there, as you keep talking, more questions keep coming up. I don't know. One quick one before I get to the heavy one which is: it's argued by hatha yogis that perfecting the body advances the spirit or something. Can you tell us of the advantages of hatha yoga? GURURAJ: Hatha yoga is a very small part of yoga as a whole. Now as you would know, the word "yoga" means union: to unite the little self with the higher self. Good. Now in India in ancient times, children were taught hatha yoga from a very young age. From when they're seven, eight they are sent to an ashram, and the guru teaches them hatha yoga

9. US 82-5 exercises. And the body does need exercising. There's one advantage hatha yoga has over the ordinary gymnastics that we do, physical training or weight lifting, it is this: that hatha yoga is aimed more at the organs within oneself, the kidneys and the spleen and the bladder and all the various organs. And through these various postures, a gentle massage of the internal organs take place. But if you think hatha yoga is going to lead you to Divinity, you are mistaken. It is just a very small part to keep you healthy. Now if you are healthy, you have more energy, more energy to pursue on the spiritual path. [END SIDE ONE] GURURAJ: ... to pursue the spiritual path. Now when you have more energy and you're living in an ashram, you would naturally spend a lot of time on spiritual practices. But that has to be offset by some physical activity because too much spiritual practice without counterbalancing it with physical exercise or whatever. Then I've seen some movements that are running wild here in America. I've been to a course in Spain where one of the gurus was holding a course. And they were told to do something called rounding. Now I don't know why they don't call it squaring. Rounding, they do it for hours. And I've seen people walking around so spaced out like zombies. So instead of integration, it's fragmentation. Right. So hatha yoga has its place, but it is not a prerequisite to enlightenment or spiritual growth. You do not need to do hatha yoga in order to ... if you do it, it's good. If you have the temperament for that kind of thing, it is very good. I encourage that. But at the same time it is not a necessary must for spiritual growth. You can do yoga every moment of the day without even doing the asanas. How you bend down, how you stand up, how you lift your arm, how you turn your neck, these are all yogic postures. And what is the sense of contorting your body as a contortionist would and getting both of your legs behind your neck? No. No. You have the simple hatha yoga exercises if you prefer and there are sufficient enough. And that could be done daily. Even while you're walking with each step you measure your breath. You're doing pranayama and yoga together. When you're walking, every step you take are you really aware of the step you're taking, or is it just a mechanical process? If you are aware, then you're doing yoga. You'r e developing awareness. So with hatha yoga... if those that do it must remember one thing: that their mind should be combined with the body so that the mind and the body flow together and bring about, without any strain or effort, an integration between mind and body where the mind can become very cal m. There are many schools of hatha yoga that invite me to teach their students how to meditate. And I show them how to do these asanas, as they are called, postures, and at the same time do a meditation. Do you see? So these things can be combined. Some of the greatest masters, like Ramakrishna, Vivekananda, Ram Tirtha, all these chaps, they never did

10. US 82-5 hatha yoga. It's not necessary for them. It might be necessary for some, and that is why I always insist on individual techniques. On many people's forms, when I return them, I write "do hatha yoga" because it is necessary for that person. You see? On many I don't because it is not necessary for them. So it is an individual matter, for some very helpful and for some not necessary at all. And talking about diet earlier on and physical health, when a person reaches a certain stage of spiritual enlightenment, he does not care for his body anymore. Shivananda was a severe diabetic. Raman Maharshi you must have heard these names; they're great masters he died of cancer. Ramakrishna had cancer. And most of these masters die very young: Christ, thirty three, they say; Ramakrishna, fifty; Vivekananda, thirty eight; Ram Tirtha, thirty four, thirty five. They give so much of themselves. They totally ignore their body because they are so engrossed in the spirit. They are the spirit just living in a body, and they do not care for the body at all. Many times people ask me, "Guruji, you've got... you had a heart operation, and you're a diabetic. and you have got cancer. And you've got this, and you've got that." It's because I don't care for the body. The doctors get surprised. "How do you manage to live?" I say, "Look. You guys only think of physical energies and mental energies. But you forget spiritual energy. And that is what I live on." And I can live this life indefinitely. And leave it, leave this body when I desire to leave it. Do you see? Now there's and old saying: "Physician heal thyself." It is fallacious. There's no truth in it. That's okay for the ordinary physician but not the physician of the spirit. As soon as I would apply my attention to myself, I will lose whatever spiritual force I have in me because I would become thinking of myself I would become ego centered. And once you become ego centered, you are blocking off the flow of the spiritual force that is within you. So the spiritual master must always, always and always never think of himself. He might think of himself as an instrument in the hands of Divinity, and that is all. I do not belong to myself. I belong to the Father. So I could never ever put attention on myself. And when you neglect the body naturally all these things would come up. And then after all I had a very hard life. I worked twenty hours a day for many, many, many years, being in the film world. And that is a very tense business. And so naturally your heart could give in. But seven years ago, July 31st will be seven years that I had my heart operation, and I'm fit as a fiddle. Strong. Well. Always smiling. Sometimes I get a bit tired when I overdo things, overexert, but that's about all. But then with meditation.... Take today's example, from this morning until now and with the exception of a nap this afternoon, I've been on the go all the time, talking, talking, talking. And you can keep me talking until two o'clock tomorrow morning, and I'll still be talking as I am talking now. No fatigue. Why? Is it the body? This body, it is totally rotten. But it's that inner body.

11. US 82-5 And whatever I teach, I teach of my own personal experience and not the experience of others. I first experience it then I talk about it. Otherwise I won't. I can't. That's hypocrisy if you do. You don't talk about God if you have not known God . And that is the trouble with all our priests today and pastors and reverends and... they talk of book knowledge. They go to a college and learn these things, and then they repeat it over like parrots. And whenever you ask them a question, they say, "Ahh, the book says so." They can't even think to answer themselves. They refer you to the book. And this happens in all the religions everywhere; in Islam, in Hinduism, in Buddhism, in Christianity, Taoism, the whole lot. As soon as they're stuck, they can't answer you, they say, "Yes, verse and passage so and so says that." And that's your answer. Do you see? So life must have its experiential value, and that is the only way to really "know thyself." By experiencing thyself. You see it works. Next question. CHELA: Guruji, speak to us of increasing our receptivity or attunement with divine will. GURURAJ: [Recording recommences in the middle of the response.]... comment of the day. Receptivity, that's a beautiful word. You've knocked the nail on the head. Yes. If you become the receptacle, grace just dawns on you. You don't need to seek for it or find it. Just become the receptacle, and spiritual practices make you the receptacle, make you receptive. When you become receptive, all the good things are there just waiting and ready. How many times haven't you passed a lovely garden and missed seeing the beautiful flowers? How many times haven't you speeded along the road and missed all the lovely scenery? That is what we do in life. We pass it by. We just miss it. It's like driving a car. Like this young girl. A traffic cop stopped her and says, "Miss, you've been doing eighty miles and hour." So she says, "Splendid! I just learned to drive yesterday." [Laughter.] Next. CAROL: Guruji, there are so many wars going on right now in the world and so much unrest. What can we in our world, each of us, do to help our large world? GURURAJ: You've answered the question yourself, Carol. Yes. All the wars in the world are faked. Now what I mean by the wars being faked is that they are based upon economics. All the wars in the past too, the basis was nothing else but economics: to create greater markets, to provide greater, more employment when unemployment become rife, to try

12. US 82-5 and stabilize economy or the country's deficit. And war balances that. So wars will always be created in this world. There have always been wars. Every so many years pass and there is a war. But the real war which I'm concerned about is the war within the individual man. How to resolve the conflicts that is within one's self. And as I use the analogy so, so very often, that it is the nature of a flower to be beautiful, but that is not the only thing it does. It also enhances the beauty of the garden. So leave the politicians and their economics alone and their greed for power. It'll always go on. Even in Krishna's time, the war of the Kurukshetras between the Kauravas and the Pandavas, contrived by greed and possession. Even during the development of Christianity, millions of people were killed. And you know the story of the crusaders, the crusades. Even in Islam where they ruled and conquered with the sword to develop the organization. I’ve stopped calling them churches anymore. Organizations. Business systems. That's what they are. Do you see? So man must be concerned more about the conflicts that rage within himself. And that is why we have our spiritual practices and the little understanding which I might be able to give you. Theory and practice. So we have our spiritual practices that reduces the conflict, the inner conflict, that is there. By gaining a greater and deeper understanding we can see things in a different perspective, thereby also reducing conflicts. So the greatest war that one has to confront is the war that rages within oneself. But yet at the same time we also pray for the peace of the world. But our prayers become invalidated because we are not at peace in ourselves. But it's always good to pray for world peace. Many countries have a day of prayer for world peace. Good. Send out good thought, good loving vibrations, and they do have some effect. But if you are thinking, if you may be thinking that there will be no more wars in the world, that there will be an age of enlightenment, that is not true. That wi ll never happen. There's never been an age of enlightenment because we are a small space in this vast continuum. And as highly evolved souls pass away from this planet not necessarily enlightened souls, but highly evolved souls for whom this planet does not become or remain conducive for their spiritual growth then they go to another planet that has higher beings. And there are other planets that have more evolved beings than what we have here. In this world at this moment there are very few enlightened men. Very few. You can count them on the fingers of your one hand. One or two of them are active. The others are not. Just waiting for their bodies to fall off. That's all. But yet you'd be surprised how much this is necessary, how much spiritual force they exert in this world to bring some sort of balance, although not total balance. The odds are too great. So during Christ's time also you found all the quarreling masses. He was the most despised man on earth. Rejected by his own people. Rejected by the Sadducees, the Pharisees, Sanhedrins, the Romans, the works. And what a great

13. US 82-5 spiritual force he was. What a great spiritual force he was. And if he was not so great, then his teachings would have not lasted until today. Do you see? And because of his great spiritual force he had to undergo all the suffering because his state of evolution, an enlightened man, was too advanced for the ordinary people to understand. Yes, they condemned him because he used to wine and dine with the pharisees and the money lenders. They used to condemn him, and even his closest disciples used to be so jealous of him when he was so close to Mary Magdalene. And this was discovered in some new scroll they found, and there was a series of articles in The Observer, a paper published in England. Do you see? They could not understand him. How can they? How can you see what is on top of a twenty story building if you are not standing on another twenty story building? If you're standing on the side walk, you'll have a very slanted view and can never see what's on top. But then these men, these great men, never defend themselves, say what they want to. They will just go marching on like an elephant marching down the road, and there could be a hundred dogs barking. And he does not care two hoots. Let them bark. I go on and do my work. That was the attitude of Jesus. Take Krishna, for example. Same thing. He was a great statesman. Strategy, he was instrumental in creating that war of Kurukshetra between the Kauravas and the Pandavas. And of course this could be literally or historically explained, and that could also be symbolically explained. But the truth forever remains the truth. We always say in Sanskrit, ["Sattyam e va je a te."?] Truth will always triumph. And how much dust gathers on the diamond, it must sometime blow off and shine in its full glory to all those that can see. They shall see. You see? So the object is to find or to lessen the conflict that rages within ourselves. That is important. For these wars will always be created. All the time. There will never come a time of peace. Even now there's a war going on, a world war going on, but a cold war which is even more dangerous than an actual war. All these governments trying to create all kinds of inventions, inventions of destruction. So they want to preserve peace by fear that: "I have such and such a weapon. So if you attack me, I am going to destroy you." You see? Fear. When peace should be preserved with love. You see how the world is going? Instead of encouraging love, they encourage fear. And those are the ways of the world. Let it carry on. Let us evolve ourselves. Get rid of wars within us by spiritual practices, better understanding, opening up of the heart, and becoming love. Someone asked me the other day, "Guruji, do you love?" I said, "What? I love? No, I don't love. I am love." Let's all be that. And it is possible for everyone. It's around the corner. Open that door. Open the window, the fresh air will come in. Keep it closed, the fresh air can't come in. Do you see? So it's an unfoldment, an opening, an awakening. OK? Next. CHELA: Guruji, I as a teacher, I've noticed an increasing

14. US 82-5 tendency of my students to be searching for values of a spiritual kind. They seem to live a life of misery, suffering through drugs, tiredness, lack of enthusiasm for their work. I wonder if you could say one or two things as to how we might express to the young about a spiritual life. GURURAJ: Yes, that is very beautiful and a great necessity in this world. I think I've spoken about this many times before in other countries that: do not start universities where spiritual education is given like some organizations are doin g because when you reach a certain age, your mind is so set. But start spiritual education from when the child is small, starting in school, primary school. That is the place when spiritual knowledge is to be given. So that they could be molded, grow up in that. Now I've found one thing, that in the home where are meditators, where good tapes are played all the time, the children listen. And you'd be surprised how perceptive children are. Although they might not be able to verbalize it, they feel that something good is there. And if they are nurtured and brought up in that kind of atmosphere, then juvenile delinquency would be so, so much lessened. Now today as in all countries, including America, England, and everywhere, the technological progress has been so fast. The intellects have become more and more developed. They have searched outwardly in spite of the technological developments they have searched outwardly, for they suffer of dissatisfaction within themselves. They have not the peace. They could run multi billion dollar corporations, and yet they find an emptiness. And they have gone to the highest limit of intellectual and technological development and cannot find the answer there. So the only way they can go is inward instead of outward. And therefore, there is a great interest in spiritual matters today, of finding the Kingdom of Heaven within. There's a great surge in that direction which is a very good sign. Unfortunately, many of my countrymen have come along and really misused the privileges that were given to them. Instead of them converting the outward seekers, they themselves became outward seekers for power and wealth. That is a tragedy. And when I meet some of these guys at times, I give them a piece of my mind because I'm afraid of nothing and no one. It could be the highest lord of the land. And if I want to say something, I say it openly and clearly and in no uncertain terms. So that is a tragedy. But those that do understand, they might be performing some little good work. Fine. Good. Anyone on the spiritual path should be encouraged to find himself. By finding himself, his life will become more peaceful, and that's what we want. "The peace that passeth all understanding." We need this integration, the mind and body has been led so far outward. It is about time that more and more people like you would make an right about turn and start going inward. For only there is peace to be found. A millionaire might become a multi millionaire and the multi millionaire

15. US 82-5 might become a billionaire. But what has he gained as far as his own personal peace is concerned? Therefore, the scriptures would say, "What is the use of gaining the world and losing your soul?" And souls are being lost. They are not lost; we say these words figuratively and not to be taken in its literal sense because the soul of men can never be lost. But it can be enmeshed with these total materialistic, unbalanced desires. Now I'm not against materialism. But what I would like to see is that spirit, spirituality be infused into materiality. So that which is material becomes spiritual and that which is spiritual becomes material. It is a continuum. It is a oneness. But although having two eyes, we close one eye and just look at the material part. And if we open the other eye and see the spiritual part as well, then we find the two eyes properly focused. And in that proper focusing the spirituality and materiality is infused. Do you see? Because we need materiality. We need it. If I haven't got at home fifty cents, fifty six cents, in my pocket, I can't go and buy a loaf of bread. And I need the sustenance. So that's material. Fine. And you walk outside. God's air is free but we are paying for it actually in taxes. Yes. So we cannot escape materiality. This body is material. Flesh and bone. It's material. You see. But the spiritual side of man can be deeply infused in that materiality so that it functions holistically. It functions in a wholeness. That is healing. To be healed is to become whole. Do you see? It is beautiful really if we think about it. It is beautiful. And it is not an impossibility. It's within the reach of everyone. It's just by directing one's attention. And with spiritual practices you'd find that we would see lesser and lesser faults in things. And we will see greater and greater good in things. That is practical infusion in practical daily living. Do you see? And then we stop being judgmental. "Judge ye not that ye be judged." "Love thy neighbor as thyself." "Do unto others as you expect to be done unto you." These injunctions become realities, not just words on the printed page. And that's what we want. So simple. You don't need to make it complex. Very simple. Simple understanding of what life is all about. And if you know life, you know love. And if you know love, you know laughter which is joy. We had to use the word laughter in our motto because there's three L's. Instead of saying L L J, we say three L's. But laughter, I mean joy by it. Do you see? Next? You know this woman had three husbands, and funny enough all the husbands, the three she had, they were all named William. Each and every husband was called William. That was their Christian names. So the friend says to her that, "You must have really been a Bill collector." [Laughter.] Isn't, isn't that what they call William? Bill? Yes. Ok. If there are no more questions, then we shall adjourn for the night.

16. US 82-5 ***END***

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